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Post by energypower on Nov 30, 2019 9:56:48 GMT 12
Has any SNZ official ever been stood down or reprimanded, fined for making the wrong call?
Before any one says they are "volunteers" I understand they are "paid volunteers".
Having enjoyed speedway for over 65 years, I sense of recent times, some SNZ officials are out to get some competitors.
Having read the press releases it appears the affected official did not see it as a reporting offence. Another over zealous official did and speedway has got itself into the debacle it is now in. Not a good look for speedway and winning paying spectators.
As I have said in another post speedway is competing for the entertainment dollar. This latest episode will not help that cause.
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Post by percy on Nov 30, 2019 10:09:37 GMT 12
I was gonna ask the same thing. I'll also ask since there is no grounds for appeal and no monetary figure mentioned where the $2k appeal fee comes from? If it's an arbitrary amount they've just made up that needs looking into. percy is there a fixed cost for appeals in that dreary tome of theirs? The $2k appeal fee is mandated in the rule book M7-10 Appeals M7-10-7 Lodging an appeal (b) Such appeal shall be accompanied by payment of an appeal fee of $2,000.00
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Post by robbobinnz on Nov 30, 2019 10:11:14 GMT 12
A few years ago when I was a steward, A well known competitor shoved me, I had no issue in stopping him going onto the track and forwarded it to the board. He was fined and made a donation to a charity.when the incident happened he apologized to me and said he would accept the punishment he deserved. looking at the video clip , it was more ofjab/prod then a friendly tap on the shoulder
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Post by my2cents on Nov 30, 2019 12:00:21 GMT 12
I think the $2K was an amount decided to stop appeals clogging up the system. If you are going to put up $2k you will be pretty sure you've got a good case. Same with protest I have heard of a NZ title a couple of seasons ago having 12 protests on the first night, "cause I may have an outside chance of qualifying and it only cost $40." Now a protest is $200
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Post by my2cents on Nov 30, 2019 12:00:54 GMT 12
Has any SNZ official ever been stood down or reprimanded, fined for making the wrong call? . YES
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Post by energypower on Nov 30, 2019 13:13:13 GMT 12
If so. What was the penalty?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2019 19:04:50 GMT 12
At the end of the day he needs to learn to keep his cool , admittedly what he done was no big deal but it starts with a poke of push then leads on to an official eventually getting hit .
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2019 19:53:01 GMT 12
There was a little attitude in the push, cant be done in sport. Rugby guy hooked the ref got a life ban, so two weeks doesn't seem to be over the top. If it was let go it would turn into a nightmare situation like it was in English Premier Football, back when that mental head Roy Keane captained Man U.
I have looked again and again and i have to say..today it looks harmless,
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Post by midway on Nov 30, 2019 23:18:52 GMT 12
At the end of the day he needs to learn to keep his cool , admittedly what he done was no big deal but it starts with a poke of push then leads on to an official eventually getting hit . Very cool indeed Charlie ,especially when your engine is on fire ,and little or no response from officialdom while they discuss how cool it will be to extinguish the flame . Sitting in your arm chair thinking he should of kept his cool is easy to say Sir ,but when you were a stockcar jockey how would of you reacted or would youve let it burn to threads ,some how Charles i dont think so .. And to the gentleman who knows so much about attitude well its a bit like the pot calling the kettle black isnt it . Would your Attitude be the same as Charles was keep your cool let the block melt theres plenty more down at Rio Tinto
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Post by nakifans on Dec 1, 2019 5:10:46 GMT 12
Reading the thread posted by Phill B top of p2, SNZ states that 2 incidents of physical and verbal abuse occurred that night. Only 1 incident, the brakes on fire and tapping the official to draw his attention to get the fire crew on the job are being reported. Was it the 2nd incident which isn't being covered the one which sealed Pickens fate along with his admission of guilt. Should a promoter be seen to influence the cause of justice[ 1/2 appeal fee ], as Pickens is bums on seats therefore money in his pockets.
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Post by Wingnut99 on Dec 1, 2019 7:49:45 GMT 12
So why has it taken so long for the process of SNZ to take place ?? The recommended process is stated in the SNZ rule book. As the drivers rep wasn't in the area Step 3 could not be completed. Thus, instead of a penalty being applied on the night the incident was referred to the SNZ board to be heard at their next board meeting. As it happens that meeting was 27 days after the incident. STEP 1 Competitor breaks rule in book.
STEP 2 Offence witnessed by Steward, Referee, or reported to Steward by other Official.
STEP 3 The Steward calls together the Clerk of the Course and the Competitor's Representative and chairs a Protest Meeting. (All persons affected by or who may be affected by the outcome of the protest meeting, including the person against whom the protest was lodged must be given the opportunity to state their view to the Protest Committee). In the case of a racing incident the Referee must be interviewed by the Protest Committee.
STEP 4 If the offending competitor ADMITS or acknowledges actions to the Steward or Referee, that action will become a "MATTER OF FACT" The Steward will then take the appropriate action. NOTE: There will be no right of appeal for penalties imposed on "MATTERS OF FACT" acknowledged by both sides, except with leave of Steward or referee concerned.
STEP 5 If the offending competitor DENIES the actions the PROTEST will be considered by the PROTEST COMMITTEE. Their decision will be by majority vote and will be given by the Steward who will apply penalty where appropriate. NOTE: To facilitate the flow of a meeting the Protest Committee may elect to handle a dispute at the completion of the programme, EXCEPT in cases where the outcome of their decision may affect the starting position or results of other heats of a series on any ONE day. Not being a lawyer but could be open to appeal on the grounds of the rule; Steps 1 to 5 will all take place at and during the meeting and should be completed no later than one hour after the last race on the programme. If MP did not call a protest and did not admit any thing to the steward, then all of the above does not apply.
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Post by bikeboy on Dec 1, 2019 8:16:24 GMT 12
The recommended process is stated in the SNZ rule book. As the drivers rep wasn't in the area Step 3 could not be completed. Thus, instead of a penalty being applied on the night the incident was referred to the SNZ board to be heard at their next board meeting. As it happens that meeting was 27 days after the incident. STEP 1 Competitor breaks rule in book.
STEP 2 Offence witnessed by Steward, Referee, or reported to Steward by other Official.
STEP 3 The Steward calls together the Clerk of the Course and the Competitor's Representative and chairs a Protest Meeting. (All persons affected by or who may be affected by the outcome of the protest meeting, including the person against whom the protest was lodged must be given the opportunity to state their view to the Protest Committee). In the case of a racing incident the Referee must be interviewed by the Protest Committee.
STEP 4 If the offending competitor ADMITS or acknowledges actions to the Steward or Referee, that action will become a "MATTER OF FACT" The Steward will then take the appropriate action. NOTE: There will be no right of appeal for penalties imposed on "MATTERS OF FACT" acknowledged by both sides, except with leave of Steward or referee concerned.
STEP 5 If the offending competitor DENIES the actions the PROTEST will be considered by the PROTEST COMMITTEE. Their decision will be by majority vote and will be given by the Steward who will apply penalty where appropriate. NOTE: To facilitate the flow of a meeting the Protest Committee may elect to handle a dispute at the completion of the programme, EXCEPT in cases where the outcome of their decision may affect the starting position or results of other heats of a series on any ONE day. Not being a lawyer but could be open to appeal on the grounds of the rule; Steps 1 to 5 will all take place at and during the meeting and should be completed no later than one hour after the last race on the programme. If MP did not call a protest and did not admit any thing to the steward, then all of the above does not apply.you could appeal to the sports tribunal, but you would not get a date before the 22 days was up anyway, on another point, had he or his team read the rule book? and the fixed penalties? when he admitted it, the board had no choice, the same as if he had admitted it on the night, 22 day stand down is a mandatory punishment for contact with an offical, he got the lowest charge available to him for that offence,
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2019 9:28:37 GMT 12
There was attitude in the push, cant be done in sport, he has no right to attack officials. Rugby guy hooked the ref got a life ban, so two weeks doesn't seem to be over the top. If it was let go it would turn into a nightmare situation like it was in English Premier Football, back when that mental head Roy Keane captained Man U...the attitude to screaming at refs and being face into face with them will show you how bad it can get when dealing with attitudes and ego's. ANY OTHER TIME IN THE SEASON ..there may not have been a bother with 2 nights off..I guess its all part of becoming the final product.... Exactly ,, Let him off the hook and it will only get worse . And because its Michael Pickens he supposed to get away with it. Have a good look at the video as many times as you like , theres no way Pickens was alerting the official to any fire but just being a jumped up idiot.
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Post by midway on Dec 1, 2019 10:13:03 GMT 12
Reading the thread posted by Phill B top of p2, SNZ states that 2 incidents of physical and verbal abuse occurred that night. Only 1 incident, the brakes on fire and tapping the official to draw his attention to get the fire crew on the job are being reported. Was it the 2nd incident which isn't being covered the one which sealed Pickens fate along with his admission of guilt. Should a promoter be seen to influence the cause of justice[ 1/2 appeal fee ], as Pickens is bums on seats therefore money in his pockets. There is no justice ,that is why the promoter has paid half the fee ,and all the facts werent taken into account . So it is a Matter Of Fact a one eyed official can deliver his facts on the matter ,without consultation with any other officials who were present and also didnt want the matter arising to go any further ,even by a written letter signed by the official to the board .
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