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Post by penman on Jan 29, 2012 9:29:29 GMT 12
I'd certainly hope the SNZ ref can see very well from where he is...for all sorts of reasons. maybe its one of those one eyed refs you keep refering too  ;D That I keep referring to? I'd be interested to see which post of mine suggested one-eyeism... |
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Post by mike616 on Jan 29, 2012 9:32:21 GMT 12
Have you ever thought that some of you should get off your ass and go help out at your local speedway rather that just sitting on here and criticising every little thing that happens.... Speedway needs more helpers around there tracks.. As for the ref i dont think some of you realise what there job entails and maybe the drivers have been told that they are not going to stop and start the race every 2 seconds for cars spun on the track... or maybe cars were given a few laps to try get going again( as some hot engines are hard to start). It is hard to see some cars from the tower sometimes as they could be on an angle or under poor lighting. But im pretty sure the refs try their best so stop bagging them all the time and maybe some of you people should go give it a go and see how good you are ..  |
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Post by penman on Jan 29, 2012 9:43:17 GMT 12
Have you ever thought that some of you should get off your ass and go help out at your local speedway rather that just sitting on here and criticising every little thing that happens.... Speedway needs more helpers around there tracks.. As for the ref i dont think some of you realise what there job entails and maybe the drivers have been told that they are not going to stop and start the race every 2 seconds for cars spun on the track... or maybe cars were given a few laps to try get going again( as some hot engines are hard to start). It is hard to see some cars from the tower sometimes as they could be on an angle or under poor lighting. But im pretty sure the refs try their best so stop bagging them all the time and maybe some of you people should go give it a go and see how good you are .. I have NO issue with cars being given time to restart under their own power or races not being stopped for every car that's spun. None at all. But, when drivers are indicating for assistance, or there's a car in a dangerous spot that may result in something that's potentially hazardous (think Scott Miers stopped in the middle of the PN straight), running one lap...or two...or three before the reds come on isn't acceptable. If the refs can't see the entire track from their position, then something needs to be done about it, or an extra chain of communication added so that these issues can be relayed quickly. I'm all for helping out at tracks or doing other things to assist speedway on a voluntary...but, given their position and influence on either a race outcome or the safety of those who compete, SNZ refs shouldn't be above being scrutinised (rather than suggesting we are 'bagging' them). Highlighting the issues is one way of trying to get them fixed. |
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Post by chris56 on Jan 29, 2012 9:45:15 GMT 12
my dad volunteers at kihikihi and roped me into this season i'm enjoying it great people there dont know much so just ask the Q's i'm learning all the time so yeah much different on inside the track ;D most meetings on sunday, so still can go huntly etc then go kihikihi in afternoon i'm sure they looking for people so see daniel
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Post by BarryB on Jan 29, 2012 9:54:39 GMT 12
Highlighting the issues is one way of trying to get them fixed. How, when, where and why issues are highlighted often comes into question however. And the "scrutiny" you refer to is always from a different angle (different view from the spectator embankment), and nobody, the ref or the keyboard jockeys, can be looking everywhere at once. Not picking on your post penman, just using it as an example of the dozens of armchair experts after the fact that we seem to be hearing more and more from. Also not saying the infield calls are always right, nor those of the ref, but micro-analysing of every little inch of action on any given night isn't going to do much to help the overall situation either, IMHO of course. I'd like to suggest if any of you are really serious about trying to help or fix any given situation, try a different course of action. Pounding away on here will only EVER be seen as bagging, no matter how you try and phrase your words. |
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Post by penman on Jan 29, 2012 10:17:53 GMT 12
Highlighting the issues is one way of trying to get them fixed. How, when, where and why issues are highlighted often comes into question however. And the "scrutiny" you refer to is always from a different angle (different view from the spectator embankment), and nobody, the ref or the keyboard jockeys, can be looking everywhere at once. Not picking on your post penman, just using it as an example of the dozens of armchair experts after the fact that we seem to be hearing more and more from. Also not saying the infield calls are always right, nor those of the ref, but micro-analysing of every little inch of action on any given night isn't going to do much to help the overall situation either, IMHO of course. I'd like to suggest if any of you are really serious about trying to help or fix any given situation, try a different course of action. Pounding away on here will only EVER be seen as bagging, no matter how you try and phrase your words. I'll agree with you Barry...but only to a point. This is a forum discussion on speedway...and refs play a large part in the sport. I've tried to be anything but negative about it, but it's my opinion (humble though it may be) that the reds last night took too long to be thrown. Rather than suggest the refs were at fault, I've leant more towards the feeling that there are reasons behind it and can they be rectified. Perhaps it's more immediate communication methods to the tower for the ref, a few more pairs of eyes applied to the process....anything that allows the sport to remain safe, but still retaining the unique aspects it's famous for. I would have made my comments at the time (as a number of people around me seemed to be doing), but I had neither a keyboard with me to do so, plus I was doing my own bit for speedway by scribbling down notes that may be used in the media tomorrow, depending on who does what tonight. I would have scribbled something down about them last night too, but it was LATE when I got home and I had a junior fan I needed to get dusted off and put to bed. I hugely appreciate the effort put in by SNZ members, locals, club members, volunteers , etc that run each night for speedway fans. BUT, as I stated, at the levels we're talking about here, there has to be the option of scrutiny...or opinion...hence, transparency, clarity and improvement of the sport. |
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Post by kiatoa on Jan 29, 2012 10:36:37 GMT 12
it is not that easy from the infield to see thumbs down all the time due to car angle, how driver strapped in, as often drivers cant get their hands out enough to be visable, so it can sometimes take a bit longer to clarify if driver is thumbs down, sometimes it does take crowd to make it more aware to infield as if a car out by wall you can only get so close to end of track to see. Last year i approached SNZ with a in car race light system. The system displayed the track status to driver in a small box on dash and secondly had the ability to alert the ref of "Thumbs down" situation. I had worked with Massey uni incubator to design the system. The idea came to me when i was first driving in Auckland and found the track lights difficult to see as dusk set. The system was a small box with in eyeline of driver- taking away the " didnt see them come on" hard to believe. Also it had the ability to eliminate the need for in field flag marshalls in unsafe positions. The cost of each unit would have been under $300 and less that $800 to set up each track. Didnt get supported at the remitts |
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Post by penman on Jan 29, 2012 10:38:52 GMT 12
it is not that easy from the infield to see thumbs down all the time due to car angle, how driver strapped in, as often drivers cant get their hands out enough to be visable, so it can sometimes take a bit longer to clarify if driver is thumbs down, sometimes it does take crowd to make it more aware to infield as if a car out by wall you can only get so close to end of track to see. Last year i approached SNZ with a in car race light system. The system displayed the track status to driver in a small box on dash and secondly had the ability to alert the ref of "Thumbs down" situation. I had worked with Massey uni incubator to design the system. The idea came to me when i was first driving in Auckland and found the track lights difficult to see as dusk set. The system was a small box with in eyeline of driver- taking away the " didnt see them come on" hard to believe. Also it had the ability to eliminate the need for in field flag marshalls in unsafe positions. The cost of each unit would have been under $300 and less that $800 to set up each track. Didnt get supported at the remitts Were there reasons given? |
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Post by plody on Jan 29, 2012 10:43:53 GMT 12
PENMAN......... maybe the ref was givig them time to start them selves just because i car stops does not mean that the reds come on. It seems that alot of the time people are going thumbs down just coz they can its rubbish... however those guys that do go thumbs down coz they are hurt i have no problem with.
now in regrds to the red lights its the REFS call NOT the huntly officials so give them a break mate or go and talk to the REF urself about ur concerns
Thanks
Andre
Stockcar 5H
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Post by kiatoa on Jan 29, 2012 10:45:24 GMT 12
Last year i approached SNZ with a in car race light system. The system displayed the track status to driver in a small box on dash and secondly had the ability to alert the ref of "Thumbs down" situation. I had worked with Massey uni incubator to design the system. The idea came to me when i was first driving in Auckland and found the track lights difficult to see as dusk set. The system was a small box with in eyeline of driver- taking away the " didnt see them come on" hard to believe. Also it had the ability to eliminate the need for in field flag marshalls in unsafe positions. The cost of each unit would have been under $300 and less that $800 to set up each track. Didnt get supported at the remitts Were there reasons given? SNZ liked the idea as it would give a uniform alert to all drivers- but i believe didn't want to force it upon drivers, so suggested it go to remitts and left it up to them to decide- it was supported by one clubs vote i believe but a hard thing to get through there i believe. Looking at offering it to a club to trial. |
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Post by Skorp on Jan 29, 2012 10:59:26 GMT 12
I wonder how hard it is for officials to not watch the racing or their favourite car. Im not being cheeky but its a spectator sport and weather your an official or a fan you watch the racing, I wonder if things accidentally get missed as attention is drawn elsewhere. as someone who recently starting helping out as a flag marshal, i can say, yes, it can be hard not to just watch the racing. however, you do need to be able to spot and watch for those situations where the lights will come on. im constantly scanning the track watching for the drivers i know to be stirrers and getting ready to put my flag out when they start to stir things up, and watching for cars parked in unsafe positions. i used to be able to follow who was leading most races, even while watching for crashes, but now im more focused on watching for trouble, so im ready put my flag out |
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Post by bruiser on Jan 29, 2012 11:05:01 GMT 12
Well said ROW. As a member of the Huntly Fire-Rescue crew (of 25 years experience at Huntly and 18 years in the local fire brigade) we do feel we know a little about what is happening.
We DO NOT carry radios. we can see dirvers with Thumbs down, we can see fire and is exactly as you say ROW.
It is bloody hard for us in the infield to even get the attention of the infield sattf with their radios to take the appropriate action.
We are bound by the instructions issued to us by the appropriate authorities prior to racing. We are VOLUNTEERS like most out there and are there SOLEY for the safety of the compeptitors and machinery.
Thanks PLODY for your input as well. The bagging hits some raw nerves at times when people sit and complain and can't get off their asses to help or assist but would rather take to their key boards and slag the officials. It is a big meeting and drivers don't like unnecessary stppages when vying for such important titles.
Enough from me
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Post by Devilracer on Jan 29, 2012 11:12:42 GMT 12
The question needs to be asked, "Where were the spotters and how many are there?" From there you can work out why it went so wrong last night. If there was just one or two missed red lights thats not so bad but EVERY red light didnt come on quick enough.
We have already lost one driver during racing we dont need to lose any more.
The ref should be listening to his spotters and there should be enough around the track on both sides of the fence that when one calls in "thumbs down turn 2" its a red light straight away.
I dont have all the answers but there must be one out the somewhere.
How much more damaged "could" have happened to Brad Ridland had another car collected him. Its just lucky no one did. We also cant be seen to be saying, "but it didnt happen". It can and it will. Least we forget, Peter Barry, we never thought that would happen.
Said it before, kiwis have a "She'll be right" attitude and it needs to change.
Apart from that and too many classes, the racing was bloody fantastic.
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Post by Skorp on Jan 29, 2012 11:25:56 GMT 12
How much more damaged "could" have happened to Brad Ridland had another car collected him. Its just lucky no one did. We also cant be seen to be saying, "but it didnt happen". It can and it will. Least we forget, Peter Barry, we never thought that would happen. i agree that we cant forget the likes of peter barry, but at the same time there are incidents like the craig healey one where even though the lights were on straight away, he still got collected and badly injured that said, we need to minimize the risks and cars in dangerous positions need to be monitored very carefully, and the race brought to a halt as soon as possible, if required |
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Post by Shai-tan on Jan 29, 2012 11:37:16 GMT 12
Red lights were shocking last night. Took eternity to go on even when the crowd on 3 and 4 were trying to get the ref's attention.
Pretty disappointed about that to be honest..... it's bad enough watching people you know racing and worse still when they are parked up thumbs down and nothing is being done about it. SNZ ref should be ashamed
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Post by penman on Jan 29, 2012 12:01:54 GMT 12
PENMAN......... maybe the ref was givig them time to start them selves just because i car stops does not mean that the reds come on. It seems that alot of the time people are going thumbs down just coz they can its rubbish... however those guys that do go thumbs down coz they are hurt i have no problem with. now in regrds to the red lights its the REFS call NOT the huntly officials so give them a break mate or go and talk to the REF urself about ur concerns Thanks Andre Stockcar 5H Settle petal! I've not made one comment about the Huntly officlals. And, if you can tell me from the infield as to which drivers are giving thumbs down "because they can" rather than being hurt, then you've got a much better handle on human nature than i. |
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Post by beachboy on Jan 29, 2012 12:10:17 GMT 12
here at palmy if one of us guys holding a flag sees debris on the track, or a driver with thumbs down, or a car on fire, we have radios and are to calmly call it in so that the ref can make the appropriate call on weather to stop the race or not. no idea how other tracks do it NEK MINNIT |
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Post by HIGHWAY45 on Jan 29, 2012 12:12:18 GMT 12
Photos by smeats on photo board of 10b roll show red lights on and a sequence of photos show cars have snuck up and made ground. Were they moved back???
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Post by penman on Jan 29, 2012 12:14:37 GMT 12
Photos by smeats on photo board of 10b roll show red lights on and a sequence of photos show cars have snuck up and made ground. Were they moved back??? The track team was pretty good at moving cars back last night.... |
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Post by Shai-tan on Jan 29, 2012 12:18:27 GMT 12
Photos by smeats on photo board of 10b roll show red lights on and a sequence of photos show cars have snuck up and made ground. Were they moved back??? The track team was pretty good at moving cars back last night.... I disagree - not far enough - those that did it legally still lost ground. At one point the officials didnt move anyone back! |
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;D
