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Post by Murray Guy (Grandad) on Jan 21, 2013 18:45:37 GMT 12
... they're only human when all is said and done. Could any of the keyboard warriors here do any better in the heat of the moment? Somehow, I doubt it. ... which is why some sports are utilizing technology, and or constantly addressing issues and pro-actively looking at opportunities to reduce mistakes. Bottom line, if competitors require a higher level of professionalism, accuracy in adjudication, in particular for events of significance, they will have to be prepared to pay. |
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Post by speedwaykitty on Jan 21, 2013 18:49:37 GMT 12
Rulebook - from SNZ in Wellington Referee - from Rotorua, with an assistant from Kihikihi Give it up people; the anti-Palmy hysteria is so 2009. The Pumas were far and away the best team on the weekend, and although the referees may have made some mistakes, they're only human when all is said and done. Could any of the keyboard warriors here do any better in the heat of the moment? Somehow, I doubt it. Thank you Inventory.. finally someone who makes sense on here. So over the anti Palmy posts |
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Post by Tony on Jan 21, 2013 19:42:14 GMT 12
Agreed Murray. And as we've seen in cricket, rugby and league, technology doesn't always end up with the right decision.
One of the beauties of sport is the human element, and the scope that produces to be able to debate our favourite sporting contests long into the night over a few ales; something I'd hate to think we'd ever lose ;D ;D
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Post by screaminV8 on Jan 21, 2013 20:09:09 GMT 12
Question: one of the Blenheim cars ended up with throttle jammed full on. Under red (for something else ) there was a lot of discussion with/by the infield officials, but he was allowed to carry on. Next red though he was pulled off.
What's the rule around that?? (I have heard of guys in supers who have driven with a jammed throttle by flicking the ignition off going into the corner each time).
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Post by Roxcyford on Jan 21, 2013 20:10:32 GMT 12
another shocking decision when hawkes bay car got rolled on the grass in frontof the finishing line rolled car got taken out & the other was allowed to carry on  |
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Post by Tony on Jan 21, 2013 20:20:32 GMT 12
another shocking decision when hawkes bay car got rolled on the grass in frontof the finishing line rolled car got taken out & the other was allowed to carry on Disagree. Watch the video here: Around the 1:25 mark the Wanganui car pushes O'Brien's car across the track on his bonnet, but stops when his front wheels hit the concrete pole-line. Gravity took over from that point ;D And to his credit, Regan had no problem with it; while the reds were on he went over and shook the other driver's hand. |
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Post by mcfly on Jan 21, 2013 20:43:27 GMT 12
my biggest concern was the number of parked cars getting hit on purpose and cars getting pushed into parked cars also on purpose its one of the biggest safety rules there is but nothing done about it In most instances the parked car was facing in an attacking position and therefor fair game. Keep in mind the number of times there were stationary cars waiting (which is against the rules - cars must be mobile at all times), if it was me I would not take the chance of a parked car being a waiting car, at least not until the officials start to penalise stationary cars if they are simply waiting. |
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Post by plody on Jan 21, 2013 21:15:46 GMT 12
my biggest concern was the number of parked cars getting hit on purpose and cars getting pushed into parked cars also on purpose its one of the biggest safety rules there is but nothing done about it In most instances the parked car was facing in an attacking position and therefor fair game. Keep in mind the number of times there were stationary cars waiting (which is against the rules - cars must be mobile at all times), if it was me I would not take the chance of a parked car being a waiting car, at least not until the officials start to penalise stationary cars if they are simply waiting. Mcfly stationary cars in teams racing is NOT illegal! The stationary car issue was brought up in drivers meeting on 1st night and made very clear that block cars were allowed to sit and wait stationary so i have no issue with that! I do think however stationary cars against walls should not be hit only my opinion |
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Post by PantherFan87 on Jan 21, 2013 22:06:29 GMT 12
another shocking decision when hawkes bay car got rolled on the grass in frontof the finishing line rolled car got taken out & the other was allowed to carry on Disagree. Watch the video here: Around the 1:25 mark the Wanganui car pushes O'Brien's car across the track on his bonnet, but stops when his front wheels hit the concrete pole-line. Gravity took over from that point ;D And to his credit, Regan had no problem with it; while the reds were on he went over and shook the other driver's hand. AMEN!!!  Was it Hilton Parker that put him over? Cos I'm pretty sure he's not a cheat... And Regan would have probably been one of the first people to the protest if it was anything else. |
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Post by busterbell on Jan 21, 2013 22:17:22 GMT 12
In most instances the parked car was facing in an attacking position and therefor fair game. Keep in mind the number of times there were stationary cars waiting (which is against the rules - cars must be mobile at all times), if it was me I would not take the chance of a parked car being a waiting car, at least not until the officials start to penalise stationary cars if they are simply waiting. Mcfly stationary cars in teams racing is NOT illegal! The stationary car issue was brought up in drivers meeting on 1st night and made very clear that block cars were allowed to sit and wait stationary so i have no issue with that! I do think however stationary cars against walls should not be hit only my opinion funny the rulebook i have clearly states you may not attack from a stationary position......... you must have a copy of the palmy one.......  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2013 3:36:14 GMT 12
Mcfly stationary cars in teams racing is NOT illegal! The stationary car issue was brought up in drivers meeting on 1st night and made very clear that block cars were allowed to sit and wait stationary so i have no issue with that! I do think however stationary cars against walls should not be hit only my opinion funny the rulebook i have clearly states you may not attack from a stationary position......... you must have a copy of the palmy one....... Teams racing rules of engagment are diffo from regular race rules Buster. Stationary cars in an attacking possition (which means the can move either forwards or backwards in the direction of the race flow) are allowed to attack, or be attacked. Pevves me off when i hear ppl in the crowd having a Wha Wha cause so and so got hit stationary, when he was clearly in an attacking possition. If through and through stockcar men don't know that then I spose we cant blame the casual observer for not knowing either really |
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Post by Tony on Jan 22, 2013 5:46:32 GMT 12
Well said Ramjam. Every spectator seems to be an expert, which makes me wonder why SNZ finds it so difficult to get referees; there were thousands of them there on Saturday and Sunday night!
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Post by BarryB on Jan 22, 2013 6:49:13 GMT 12
The "Code of Ethics" is what you need to read BellBuster
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Post by busterbell on Jan 22, 2013 8:57:08 GMT 12
The "Code of Ethics" is what you need to read BellBuster yes lets do that.......... r12-4-4 (f) Attacking cars MUST avoid cars that are in a non attacking position. (Any inference that one can legitimately hit all stationary cars has been removed from the rules.) backed up by r12-3-5 Attacking from a stationary position or hitting a stationary car is not permitted. Those vehicles which wish to wait for an opposing member should be moving, however slowly at all times in the correct direction. (It must be remembered that this competition is called racing and parked vehicles are not considered to be still part of the competition.) direct quote from my snz rulebook......... |
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Post by BarryB on Jan 22, 2013 9:12:15 GMT 12
So an attacking car does not have to avoid a stationery car in an attacking position..........
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Post by busterbell on Jan 22, 2013 9:27:41 GMT 12
So an attacking car does not have to avoid a stationery car in an attacking position.......... you are being facetious mr barryb.  |
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Post by Admin on Jan 22, 2013 10:38:12 GMT 12
Have just spoken with Rod McNaughton the Ref in charge at this meeting and he tells me that unknown to most spectators many drivers were called up and spoken to over the course of the weekend . Not many incidents were considered game changers thus the old 'word to the wise' method was mostly used rather than becoming heavy handed with a big stick. Generally speaking he thought the drivers were awesome in their behavior on the track and off.
There were a couple of incidents that may have been handled differently but the call was made in the moment of time they occurred as the situation demands.
Red lights and positions of cars are always a topic of controversy and the difference between being a spectator and a referee is that the referee knows when he is about to red light a race and gives his officials a quick heads up so they can take note of who is where . The spectator is only aware of the red light once the lights are activated.
The chances of getting it correct are heavily weighted on officialdom's side but nobody gets everything right 100% of the time.
From my vantage point in the grandstand I thought the running of the meeting was great , the first night in particular was most efficiently run.
I liken Stockcar teams racing to a football game with 5 balls in play at the one time. We could use more Ref's , we could use more technology , we could take all night to run one teams race.
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Post by BarryB on Jan 22, 2013 10:45:01 GMT 12
So an attacking car does not have to avoid a stationery car in an attacking position.......... you are being facetious mr barryb. No, I believe I'm reading the intent of the rule..... |
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Post by Crow on Jan 22, 2013 11:01:37 GMT 12
All teams drivers know that if you are parked in an attacking position you are fair game to be attacked. If you don't want to be attacked you go thumbs down and get out of the race.  . Maybe the public could be explained some of the rules in the build up to the event. By some one who has sat in at the drivers meeting on the night. |
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Post by busterbell on Jan 22, 2013 11:06:05 GMT 12
you are being facetious mr barryb. No, I believe I'm reading the intent of the rule..... how do you get that from this?? "Attacking from a stationary position or hitting a stationary car is not permitted." effectively you are saying lets throw the rulebook away cause what it states is not how you want to race. its up to the ref to know the rules and enforce them, not alter, ignore, or make up different ones. i see this particular rule as being very explicit. am i the only one?? |
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. Maybe the public could be explained some of the rules in the build up to the event. By some one who has sat in at the drivers meeting on the night.