|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 18:50:37 GMT 12
hi Tim thankyou for taking the time out to create this thread i drive a std stock and my question is after being spun and facing oppisite racing direction i have sat and waited for a break in the traffic to move to turn around in the wrong diection and then subsequetly fined $50 i have argued the case with the ref to no avail and was told to read the rule book i have searced and cant find the appropriate rule it says no attacking from wrong race direction my saftey and that of other competitors is paramount i disagree with being told to reverse of the track when you are paralell with in field more dangerous than using forward gears in a safe manner dont forget we are strapped in these cars tightly faceing forward and feel this sort of seemed like revenue grabbing on a club night as i saw a few cars do this at the nz champs how many of these drivers were fined thanks glenn
The relevant Rule is R12-3-18: The race will be in an anti-clockwise direction.
In terms of the penalty, individual referees have complete flexibility under the rules to issue anything from a warning to relegation, exclusion, fine and suspension - for all racing rule infringements. |
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 18:53:13 GMT 12
And a question for you Tim - do you have any job vacancies at SNZ at the mo? LOL. Maybe a SNZ-Bluebridge Co-ordinator/Liaison Officer haha. Keep up the great work mate |
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 19:03:42 GMT 12
Mintie asked:-
Prior to any national event being granted there should be a season history check of accidents to the public and how they were caused
Track conditions that have been presented to the drivers, ( you can cope with "one off" challenges but I mean below par tracks)
Track infrastructure, who is doing what job and what experience do they have ( then SNZ can gauge the assistance and guidance they may need)
Public capacity and the ability to deal with the public and also capping the public entry to the venue allowances
Pits and service areas including toilets
Once the event has been allocated there should be an on-going checking system leading up to the event that ensures it is "on track" to get everything in place.
If the track isn't measuring up SNZ can then bring someone in from their team to help them get is back on track
If there are problems with the ELS during the season, it can be checked and rectified.
There are many other things but there seems to be a gap between what the drivers and public want and what is delivered, SNZ must be driving the requirements, we all seem to know what is required, heck there are pages of suggestions, but I think there needs to be a base to work from to get it right. We don't need a task force or an investigation, I think it just needs to happen as there are enough skilled people out there that would help is asked.
So therefore my question is: will this type of process be considered as a means of helping the sport develop.
I guess the first point to note is that the current track grading criteria only applies to New Zealand titles, and compliance with this criteria is assessed annually at the pre-season track inspection. I’m not sure whether a massive response or change is necessary when most tracks get 90% of things right, but it’s certainly an area that the Promotional Team will be taking a look at. It may be that they instead decide to assist certain tracks or improve set processes.
Ultimately, again any change will come via the remit process at the AGM
|
|
|
|
Post by Rusty on Jan 16, 2014 19:07:03 GMT 12
Can a class rep sign an imfringement notice on behalf of a competitor?
|
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 19:15:20 GMT 12
kwikchange asked:-
My questions to you is a bit long winded so I will try and keep it brief,
It relates to the NZ Super Saloon just held and how Referee's/Championships need far better consistency.
3rd Heat NZ super Saloons, back markers are coming around to get the green after an orange light, Usual story back markers end up in a concentina effect after some mid to rear baulking and two cars become involved in a racing incident ( I say this as I believe there was no deliberation intention of contact.) After the Race before points were relegated/changed we had 4 cars possibly 5 tied on points for a run off.
From this incident, one driver (Driver hit) advised by another protests the Driver (Driver who tagged) regarding the incident....Now it's common knowledge the referee did not see this incident, The driver protesting took a witness with him who was also a competitor in the same championship and the decision to relegate was made.
The witness & tagging driver were both at the time supposed to be in the run off......
My 1st question? to you is, Are the referee's looking out for any possible conflict of interest in fairness to all parties involved with the protest?
OK, first thing is that I cant get into specifics as a protest was lodged on the night, which means there is still the possibility of an appeal for 2 more days.
However, more generally there are a few rules in the book that will answer your queries.
Firstly, the referee is not involved in the protest, other than as a witness.
M7-8-13 All protests are adjudicated upon by a Protest Committee consisting of:-
(i) The Steward of the meeting
(ii) One representative of the competitor's class.
(iii) The Clerk of the Course.
M7-8-18 In the case of a racing incident the Referee must be interviewed by the Protest Committee.
My next question? Should a witness be used when they are in the same Championship and there is a possibility his account of what happen could/would better his bid in the Championship? Or any other driver in the championship act as a witness when results could be changed.
Again there is a rule that covers this – it’s not so much that other competitors are "witnesses" as such, rather that they have the right to be involved in the process:-
M7-8-17 All persons affected by or who may be affected by the outcome of the protest meeting, including the person against whom the protest was lodged must be given the opportunity to state their view to the Protest Committee.
My last question is, With the introduction of track grading, should the sport and in particular our premier classes be looking at Championship grading to match? eg Formats used, Prizemoney Structures, Travelling Officials, minimum promotion expectations, etc
Most of the items above have been dealt with over the years via remits, but attempts to head down these paths have not found favour with a majority of the voting delegates at the AGM.
|
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 19:16:20 GMT 12
Good on you Tim for the opportunity. I thought long and hard and limited it to one question so here goes When will Mad Martys Superstock be finished? Cheers |
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 19:21:41 GMT 12
Tim,, Since this topic has been very topical recently, my question/s are: Did you attend the NZ Superstocks at Meeanee? If so , do you expect there will be any changes suggested for future championship meetings with regards to (1) Spectator amenities (2) Track prep ?
I sure was there. Regarding your secodn question, I can’t speak for Speedway NZ’s 3000 members, anyone of who could put forward proposed changes to the 2015 Annual General Meeting. I’m not a member, so am one of the few people who can’t submit remits! |
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 19:26:52 GMT 12
Thank you for the reply Tim. I am pleased to hear that SNZ are working on something, even if its not quite what I had in mind. Thanks again for taking the time for do this, AMA's are always interesting. Now for a none speedway related question (you did say "ask me ANYTHING"), do you prefer Pepsi or Coke? And one last question, this time speedway related, what is your favourite speedway class?
Favourite class......realistically one this this role has given me is the opportunity to travel to every speedway track and experience great racing from every class in the country. A full house at Oreti Park for a motorcycle only race programme is just as thrilling as a full house at Western Springs for an Open Wheel meeting, or Palmerston North's Superstock Teams Champs for the contact brigade. And speaking of the latter, I've been to all 33 of them, so that probably shows where my roots lie...... |
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 19:47:52 GMT 12
Hello Tim could you please tell me if its true apparently due to a flat right rear, and the "new rule" that was brought about by the spectator injuries at Meanee last week.
|
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 19:53:34 GMT 12
Do you feel that having the SGP at Western Springs has been beneficial for the sport of solo racing in NZ? And do SNZ have any plans to raise the profile of the class, or to support bike riders, such as a scholarship, so that NZ can maybe have a rider in the SGP in future?
Regarding the support for the class, for the last five seasons Speedway NZ has channelled $100 of a motorcycle competitors licence directly into a fund overseen by the elected Motorcycle Speedway Sub-Committee. They have assisted many riders with overseas travel funding, and also bought trainers to NZ.
|
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 19:57:19 GMT 12
Andre asked:- 1: how do u become a referee First step is to get nominated by a track. ............................................................................. Do you think this is a problem? We have officials that make calls to save their jobs, and this has happened a few times which im sure your aware of Tim. To show complete transparency should the officials that carry the SNZ badge and wear the SNZ uniform apply to SNZ to become an official then be positioned at tracks by SNZ? All too often we see decisions being made or not made due to the fact that they want to keep their job at that track........your views Tim. |
|
|
|
Post by TimSOZ on Jan 16, 2014 20:02:33 GMT 12
Tim I totally agreee with what bill 75 has said to you about stewards and referies being told what to do by either clerk of the course or the promoters .I can't believe why the snz officials did not take action and stop the meeting of the superstock title at Meeane from what has been posted by many in attendance that night .What does it take another fatality at a speedway before they put a stop to what sounds like a very dangerous race track.There were a number of people taken or made their own way to hospital. The media just thrive on that sort of stuff The question I asked previously just brings to light of how much it happens about how friendly you are with the stewards or refere The law is 95 decibels maximum not 103.So tell me why was he allowed to continue.Made the wrong call I reckon like most others,or in fear of loosing his job more to the point. I realise that you are here to sort out what people want to happen in speedway but they (stewards and Officials need to be held accountable more than making their own rules to suit promoters). Your job as c e o is hard but you seem to at least have a go because man it is WAY WAY overdue ,And to be a good c e o you need to answer questions BLACK & White no grey areas.That is mainly what the public want true straight answers ,not maybe or sometimes . MEN IN HATS have a look in the mirror Cause not all but a few are no where near the mark at the moment especially at Western Springs it is like a circus full of clowns. My opinion is video should be allowed because the refs can not and DO NOT see everything.Sat night the ref said he did not see what happened .//Is he for real.Will the ref from sat night at super saloon champs get stood down and re accessed because he for 1 needs to // Rant over Lyndsay Adams
The Springs International Series was run under a heady mixture of SNZ, Powri and local rules, which is permitted. Without knowing exactly what the combined set of racing rules were, I wouldn't be criticising any official.
And as mentioned I cant comment on specifics at Waikaraka Park last weekend. |
|
|
|
Post by conrod on Jan 16, 2014 20:11:02 GMT 12
kwikchange asked:-
My questions to you is a bit long winded so I will try and keep it brief,
It relates to the NZ Super Saloon just held and how Referee's/Championships need far better consistency.
3rd Heat NZ super Saloons, back markers are coming around to get the green after an orange light, Usual story back markers end up in a concentina effect after some mid to rear baulking and two cars become involved in a racing incident ( I say this as I believe there was no deliberation intention of contact.) After the Race before points were relegated/changed we had 4 cars possibly 5 tied on points for a run off.
From this incident, one driver (Driver hit) advised by another protests the Driver (Driver who tagged) regarding the incident....Now it's common knowledge the referee did not see this incident, The driver protesting took a witness with him who was also a competitor in the same championship and the decision to relegate was made.
The witness & tagging driver were both at the time supposed to be in the run off......
My 1st question? to you is, Are the referee's looking out for any possible conflict of interest in fairness to all parties involved with the protest?
OK, first thing is that I cant get into specifics as a protest was lodged on the night, which means there is still the possibility of an appeal for 2 more days.
However, more generally there are a few rules in the book that will answer your queries.
Firstly, the referee is not involved in the protest, other than as a witness.
M7-8-13 All protests are adjudicated upon by a Protest Committee consisting of:-
(i) The Steward of the meeting
(ii) One representative of the competitor's class.
(iii) The Clerk of the Course.
M7-8-18 In the case of a racing incident the Referee must be interviewed by the Protest Committee.
My next question? Should a witness be used when they are in the same Championship and there is a possibility his account of what happen could/would better his bid in the Championship? Or any other driver in the championship act as a witness when results could be changed.Again there is a rule that covers this – it’s not so much that other competitors are "witnesses" as such, rather that they have the right to be involved in the process:-
M7-8-17 All persons affected by or who may be affected by the outcome of the protest meeting, including the person against whom the protest was lodged must be given the opportunity to state their view to the Protest Committee.
My last question is, With the introduction of track grading, should the sport and in particular our premier classes be looking at Championship grading to match? eg Formats used, Prizemoney Structures, Travelling Officials, minimum promotion expectations, etc
Most of the items above have been dealt with over the years via remits, but attempts to head down these paths have not found favour with a majority of the voting delegates at the AGM.
Hi Tim Thanks for the open Book ,With regards to the last Question Are you able to say what some off the reasons why they dont go down these paths ?? I interesting to look at the Q&A and see a lot off what people are putting forward is going to the AGM but are being knocked back,and yet they seem simple and dear i say Good ways forward ,I wonder weather the delegates go to the AGM with only there tracks and whats in there interest in the voting, Im sorry that may seem Harsh ,I live for the sport it has come a long way from what it was, But there is a lot we could do for the betterment off every one every track Cheers Peter Bennett |
|
|
|
Post by mrbean on Jan 16, 2014 21:28:56 GMT 12
Would love an answer to my previous question Tim thanks :
Hi Tim - my question is : when tracks host title events is it there discretion on how much to pay for prizemoney or is the prizemoney pool allocated at SNZ level.
Just asking as I've heard many gripes about how little competitors are paid vs the amount of gate takings the promoter receives.
|
|
|
|
Post by BarryB on Jan 17, 2014 5:37:02 GMT 12
Would love an answer to my previous question Tim thanks : Hi Tim - my question is : when tracks host title events is it there discretion on how much to pay for prizemoney or is the prizemoney pool allocated at SNZ level. Just asking as I've heard many gripes about how little competitors are paid vs the amount of gate takings the promoter receives. Tim has already answered that one. This was his response; The minimum prizemonies for NZ titles were only introduced in 2012, and changing those amounts can only be done via remit at the 2015 Annual General Meeting.When a track applies for a New Zealand title, they have to state how much prizemoney they will pay in the application, so when everybody votes for who will host it 18 months into the future those minimum amounts are locked in. Let's do it on the terracotta, Barry B |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2014 7:09:59 GMT 12
If I can just butt in to the prize money query, tracks had to submit a break down of all prize money paid and who to. If that fell short of what was in the proposal them they would ask that track for a cheque to the value of the shortfall. I guess snz does that now.
|
|
|
|
Post by brettgrace on Jan 17, 2014 14:17:03 GMT 12
Hi Tim,
Firstly commendations to you for taking the time to come on here and round table with the members. I have a question(s) re the remit process and I apologise in advance if it(they) have been answered earlier.
I had a skim on the results from the last remit meeting and took notice of a few things, some of which I'm unclear about. I'll try and include as many specifics as possible.
- With regards to instant changes of the rulebook, does this cover solely the technical rules or does it extend into other areas such as racing rules, track specifications, definitions/wording and changing the policies of how SNZ is administrated?
- Is there a consultation process ala the one used with the technical committees when drafting rules for these other areas?
- I noticed in the results of a few votes than a seconder was not needed, is this the result of a unanimous vote or is this an example of the board's right to alter the rules following consultation?
On to the opinion based one(s)
- If the board can remove/alter/insert rules at any time for the common good of the sport, do you feel personally that it might be time for a look at using these powers for an alteration of the way remits are voted in?
- I noticed as a result of the last meeting that HAN restraints were mandated in a few more open wheel classes (mini sprints, tqs, sprintcars etc) and while a vote for the mandate of these devices in contact classes was cast, it was ultimately defeated. There was another proposed remit for shortening the usable life of seatbelts in the contact classes from 5 to 2 years, it was also defeated. Morally, do you feel that in instances directly concerning the safety of the members of your organisation that the board could step in and do more to see that rules designed to protect us from ourselves are at the least, phased in over time?
- Finally, if the current voting system was to go what would you personally like to see replace it?
Thanks,
Brett Grace
|
|
|
|
Post by Jamo on Jan 17, 2014 14:37:56 GMT 12
Why aren't race engine compression ratios being checked anymore at NZ titles with the "puffer" machine? Haven't been checked for the last few seasons so will they be next season?  ? |
|
|
|
Post by TonyT on Jan 17, 2014 17:39:22 GMT 12
Tim, you state several times earlier in this thread that anyone can become a member of SNZ, and we encourage you to do so, or words to that effect. I also note that throughout the thread the over riding response you give to most of the "why not do this" type of questions is that changes can only come from voting on remits at conference. Therefore, I would ask how would fans, who become members of SNZ, be able to submit and vote on remits? My understanding (and I may well be wrong) is that at present, only member clubs can vote at conference through their two allocated representatives (drivers and promoters). Will the admission of non-drivers and non-promoters (and also likely non-club members) to SNZ membership require a change in the way conference voting is carried out? Could fans potentially force this change to occur via weight of numbers?
|
|
|
|
Post by tank11 on Jan 20, 2014 17:56:57 GMT 12
Tim, any data on injuries where neck restraints are used.
IE neck restraint/seat combo/injury incurred.
Just thinking after M. Auldings accident.
|
|
