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Post by BarryB on Feb 12, 2014 5:46:42 GMT 12
Another incident that i don't think has been discussed is Malcolm Ngatai' being sent off the track. The stream (or my stream at least) was down for this race, so never saw anything of it. Barry B |
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Post by BarryB on Feb 12, 2014 5:49:08 GMT 12
Don't know about being "jostled" Barry. Couldn't see a car near his rear, but one beside him MAY have tapped his front. All in all wasn't much in it fullstop. Don't think I ever mentioned a car "near his rear"......I'm sure it's possible to be "jostled" from the side   If fact, I'd suggest that's what "jostling" is, from the front, from behind, from both sides.........I did state the 35b was involved, so that was the car on his outside. Once again I need to re-iterate this is directed solely at the ref's, because if they've refereed it as per instructions the fault lies elsewhere. Two things though, I think, before a car is sent of; 1/ You have to be 100% SURE the driver infringed the rules (I don't think you can make that call in the Joblin incident) 2/ It has to be an infringement worthy of pulling the car from the track It's all very well teams wanting it to be refereed this way and that way, which as we saw with the Nelson race on Night 2 a team will always want it to be to whatever would have suited them best in that particular race (removed early instead of penalised later or vice versa). Guys, many times it won't make a difference either way, but all we can really ask for is for the spectacle to remain, and consistency. Many other sports these days are changing their rules to increase the spectacle, to keep the ball in play more of the time, to speed the game up, to shorten the game to suit the modern-day shorter attention span phenomena....last Friday night we appeared to do EVERYTHING that went the other way to what everybody else is doing. We kept stopping races, removing the combatants, extending the time a race took to complete through red lights for nothing, spoiling the flow of the game. Is that what we want? Maybe if a driver infringes to warrant a sending off, the race is stopped and he is sent off, whereas if he is going to be relegated 1 spot a black flag with a large white thumbs-down, accompanied by a blackboard with the offending driver's number on it, is displayed for 2 laps at the start/finish line.......... Barry B |
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Post by boner87 on Feb 12, 2014 6:17:22 GMT 12
Another incident that i don't think has been discussed is Malcolm Ngatai' being sent off the track. The stream (or my stream at least) was down for this race, so never saw anything of it. Barry B From what I heard it was over him being dangerous on the infeild as in putting marshalls in "danger" Just back to the joblin incident has anyone noticed the two puffs of dust from the hawkeyes car and miers tanks which I would almost think that by the end of the night could only come from being on the grass? Just another rumour I suppose |
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Post by BarryB on Feb 12, 2014 7:16:00 GMT 12
Just back to the joblin incident has anyone noticed the two puffs of dust from the hawkeyes car and miers tanks which I would almost think that by the end of the night could only come from being on the grass? Just another rumour I suppose I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at. It's not illegal to go on the grass during a race, many do (generally not through their own choice), it's just what you do whilst there than may lead to punishment..... Barry B |
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Post by boner87 on Feb 12, 2014 7:19:21 GMT 12
Just if you look at the video turn 3 first lap both cars cut the corner which you could say is gaining an advantage no?
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Post by BarryB on Feb 12, 2014 7:22:43 GMT 12
Just if you look at the video turn 3 first lap both cars cut the corner which you could say is gaining an advantage no? I'm not sure how they would have ref'd that this year, but generally I think they really only consider that gaining an advantage if you're up the inside of another car, especially if contact is made, at the time. Warnings may have been issued. Did you want them dragged as well? Let's do it on the terracotta, Barry B |
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Post by boner87 on Feb 12, 2014 7:29:04 GMT 12
Yep fair enough I'll agree with ya there. Nah I don't like see cars being dragged at all for minor offences (I'm not sure what I'd consider as minor so don't ask). I'd like to see more of a penalty like being shifted back on the track say half a lap plus some so the offending car is not near an opposition car?
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Post by BarryB on Feb 12, 2014 7:38:12 GMT 12
That still requires stopping a race to make it happen......surely we have to avoid that if at all possible?
Barry B
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Post by boner87 on Feb 12, 2014 8:11:49 GMT 12
I realise that but would it not be the best of both worlds. Cars being pulled off for minors offences seems harsh but teams don't want it to happen after the race. Would a penalty or on track regulation be a good comprimise? Would need some fine tuning and be written properly but something simalar could be viable?
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Post by Admin on Feb 12, 2014 8:15:36 GMT 12
At the moment there is a line in the sand we call a pole line , how fuzzy do we or the drivers want the line to be?. How far is too far?
Why have a line at all if it's not going to rigidly enforced?
Me, I want the pole line to be a concrete wall or at least a raised berm of some kind that is an instant physical penalty for any car that crosses it. Our pole lines are too easily played with. They look nice but are next to useless.
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Post by BarryB on Feb 12, 2014 8:18:53 GMT 12
I realise that but would it not be the best of both worlds. Cars being pulled off for minors offences seems harsh but teams don't want it to happen after the race. Would a penalty or on track regulation be a good comprimise? Would need some fine tuning and be written properly but something simalar could be viable? Maybe if a driver infringes to warrant a sending off, the race is stopped and he is sent off, whereas if he is going to be relegated 1 spot a black flag with a large white thumbs-down, accompanied by a blackboard with the offending driver's number on it, is displayed for 2 laps at the start/finish line..........or a large digital display!!! Not sure either would work, but just trying to think of options whereby the races would not have to be stopped on a regular basis. Barry B |
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Post by BarryB on Feb 12, 2014 8:20:49 GMT 12
At the moment there is a line in the sand we call a pole line , how fuzzy do we or the drivers want the line to be?. How far is too far? Why have a line at all if it's not going to rigidly enforced? Me, I want the pole line to be a concrete wall or at least a raised berm of some kind that is an instant physical penalty for any car that crosses it. Our pole lines are too easily played with. They look nice but are next to useless. Agreed........but I guess what penalises a Superstock may destroy a Sprintcar, but I hear what you're saying....... With all of the rules over breaking away and looping around, it often means an attacking car can get a better result gently sliding an opponent towards the infield than he can against the concrete wall - that doesn't seem right to me somehow....... Barry B |
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Post by boner87 on Feb 12, 2014 8:32:22 GMT 12
At the moment there is a line in the sand we call a pole line , how fuzzy do we or the drivers want the line to be?. How far is too far? Why have a line at all if it's not going to rigidly enforced? Me, I want the pole line to be a concrete wall or at least a raised berm of some kind that is an instant physical penalty for any car that crosses it. Our pole lines are too easily played with. They look nice but are next to useless. Bring back the 44 gallon drums. If the race was stopped and the ref call was announced and the car put back a position would that be any better or no? |
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Post by BarryB on Feb 12, 2014 8:38:01 GMT 12
At the moment there is a line in the sand we call a pole line , how fuzzy do we or the drivers want the line to be?. How far is too far? Why have a line at all if it's not going to rigidly enforced? Me, I want the pole line to be a concrete wall or at least a raised berm of some kind that is an instant physical penalty for any car that crosses it. Our pole lines are too easily played with. They look nice but are next to useless. Bring back the 44 gallon drums. If the race was stopped and the ref call was announced and the car put back a position would that be any better or no? Hard to say really......depends how often it happened and how long it took Barry B |
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Post by boner87 on Feb 12, 2014 8:42:15 GMT 12
Maybe something like this could be trialed to see if works? Or put to drivers to see if they would like something simalar
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Post by BarryB on Feb 12, 2014 8:47:44 GMT 12
I'm sure they'll be meetings to discuss a way forward......
Barry B
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Post by Admin on Feb 12, 2014 8:56:04 GMT 12
At the moment there is a line in the sand we call a pole line , how fuzzy do we or the drivers want the line to be?. How far is too far? Why have a line at all if it's not going to rigidly enforced? Me, I want the pole line to be a concrete wall or at least a raised berm of some kind that is an instant physical penalty for any car that crosses it. Our pole lines are too easily played with. They look nice but are next to useless. Agreed........but I guess what penalises a Superstock may destroy a Sprintcar, but I hear what you're saying....... With all of the rules over breaking away and looping around, it often means an attacking car can get a better result gently sliding an opponent towards the infield than he can against the concrete wall - that doesn't seem right to me somehow....... Barry B I've watched a lot of youtube videos from foreign places and almost none use our style of pole line. Dirt berms , concrete walls, tractor tyres are just some of what I've seen and they're at tracks running anything from Bangers to Sprintcars and Late Models. I was impressed at how far Late Models stay away from a pole line when there are tractor tyres on the corners. No issues , no stress for the Refs either I expect. And our roughest ,toughest class in the world gets not much more than a painted line. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2014 12:01:02 GMT 12
Agreed........but I guess what penalises a Superstock may destroy a Sprintcar, but I hear what you're saying....... With all of the rules over breaking away and looping around, it often means an attacking car can get a better result gently sliding an opponent towards the infield than he can against the concrete wall - that doesn't seem right to me somehow....... Barry B I've watched a lot of youtube videos from foreign places and almost none use our style of pole line. Dirt berms , concrete walls, tractor tyres are just some of what I've seen and they're at tracks running anything from Bangers to Sprintcars and Late Models. I was impressed at how far Late Models stay away from a pole line when there are tractor tyres on the corners. No issues , no stress for the Refs either I expect. And our roughest ,toughest class in the world gets not much more than a painted line. I think wellingtons pole line is perfect. Its very high ive seen cars nearly get stuck on it and it makes it hard for people to try straight line with there LF wheel on the pole line or more |
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Post by Ford Prefect on Feb 12, 2014 13:46:58 GMT 12
The technology must by now be available enough to have 2 lights in each team car that the ref controls, if one light comes on it means you have been penalised for a "minor offence" and have to serve a penalty i.e. by doing a loop on the grass (like a penalty in the americas cup) or 2 lights means you are out of there and have to retire to the infield immediately. Teams are penalised for offenses comitted and the flow of the race isn't being disrupted. I'm no expert in RF Technology but it shouldn't be to hard to implement and shouldn't be to price prohibitive...................................could work until the opposition supporters figure out how to crack the system and start sending out penalties from the grandstand |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2014 14:03:08 GMT 12
Not a bad idea Ford Prefect .
In all honesty the stop start racing that the fans endured last weekend due to the pitiful referee calls ruined a great show.
Teams racing is very much like barbarians rugby where everyone likes to see things flow full on , but last weekends interuptions took the gloss off the meeting .
Like Barry Brown says , the punishment certainly does not fit the crime and changes need to be made to teams racing rules .
Pulling two cars out of a teams race is ludicrous , its like sin binning half of the All Black team half way through a game ..
Many people I spoke with share the same views as I did and stated that they were unlikely to go back next year .
Full credit to Bay Park they were a polished team and deserved to take the trophy home .
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If fact, I'd suggest that's what "jostling" is, from the front, from behind, from both sides.........I did state the 35b was involved, so that was the car on his outside. 
