Has the changing of the Guard just happened?? (Read 2,837 times)

[ricardo63]

Hi all, just a bit of post weekend blues and had some thoughts.
As the title suggests, have we seen the watershed meeting where the ‘lie of the land’ has shifted?? Upon reflection is this the 2007 RWC moment where the All Blacks, all conquering but when the moment came we found out that the time had past….
With this I’m in reference to the Panthers & Tigers the two most dominant teams for ages. Now I don’t expect either team to go into ‘free-fall’ but this thread is intended as ‘In their current guises’.
Nelson Tigers
• Haven’t made the semis for the past two years.
• Dale Ewers is retiring, marque & go to man??
• Don’t always seem to win the BIG matchups i.e. You have a chance.
• The way they race, hell for leather, bash everything style is getting a bit worn out??
Panthers
• When driver changes were required this year, they proved they are just like any other team, it needs time to gel.
• Driver line up isn’t getting any younger & the hits are getting bigger for sure
• Penn tried to retire a few years ago, but the Panthers were insistent on keeping it all together. Could you really blame them? Just means future development is impeded.
• Everything comes to an end & have we witnessed this

Further enhancing my thoughts is that the Busters have now made the semis (1 win) for the past two years. Hawkes Bay win ratio is second to none and made tier 1 this year, unbeaten last year. The Mustangs, are they a feeder or their own team? There is no denying it, this will have an impact. I believe we were delivered a clue to this puzzle this year….

I’m no Palmy hater or lover so try to be constructive here.

[kevin888]

just a thought but you had the standard stock teams and superstock teams champs and you always hear one man doesnt make the team but in the std stock final and supers teams peter rees was certainly a big loss in terms of how both teams perfomed in both events and you can love him or loath him but he can read and win a race

[TonyG188r]

I'm not sure if I read it all entirely correct but as I see it I believe it's not the fall of the best teams it's more the ither teams are stepping thier game right up and are all more on a level field,

Reference to the sane rugby comment the all blacks have never gotten any worse the other teams have just got better.

[BarryB]

I haven't witnessed the Panthers losing too many races over the years, certainly the Busters have been their nemisis at times but they didn't even meet this year, but what has usually happened in the past when the Panthers lose a race is that they immediately come back stronger than ever.....this time that did not happen. Aliens?


Let's do it on the terracotta,

Barry B

[chunkey]

It's unfortunate but when you are at the top you are expected to stay there, The Panthers have been at the top for a damm long time and there's only one way you go from being at the top and we all know where that is and the Panthers also found out where that is at the weekend,
I'm no Panthers supporter but they've been at the top for a while and I don't think they have lost there mojo it's just other teams have learnt from them and that's what happens in any sport. I think you'll see the Panthers pounce back at the Nationals

[boner87]

We will soon find out in months time at teams nationals in Auckland. Didn't see Friday nights racing but from what I saw on Saturday I think perhaps the style of teams racing has evolved in the last couple of years aswell as the strength of some other teams. Rotorua, hawkes bay, busters, and the unpredictable poms. A few years ago it seemed to be just palmy Nelson, palmy Nelson, etc etc. Now with more strong teams these two are unable to run there dominant two runners way out in front or a runner with two shadow cars because they are being kept well busy by other cars on the track. Just look at the final Elsworth ran around by himself for quite a bit of the time. Changing of the guard hmmm no just the guard needs a freshen up. In my opinion for the panthers anyway Bengston and Rees although he wasn't there and joblin should stay, penn is good but there is no-one that can probably fill those shoes and miers well I just don't think he was interested really?

[knownotmuch]

Over the last few seasons three of current Panthers squad have talked to us about their impending retirements from teams racing. After their managers comments, maybe he is also feeling the stress more than he used to and might be another to consider when to retire.

[chunkey]

Something the Panthers should think about!
When your children are old enough or good enough to be in the same sporting team as you maybe it's time to hang up the boots!

[Sharns With Sparky]

Palmy have a few young top stockcar drivers stepn up over next to years plus 2 ex mustangs sould be exciting

[Deleted]

Simple answer to this thread = NO . The Panthers preparations to this event were disrupted by the loss of Peter Rees .
Many were saying last week that one man doesn't make a team , well when it comes to the Panthers the loss of Rees obviously effects their performance .Rees is the kingpin of the Panthers and has shown in the past that he is capable of winning a teams race on his own. Having two cars sent off last weekend was the undoing of the Panthers and they never looked up from there .
There is no guarantee that the Hawkeyes would have won the race if the two Panthers cars were still on the track .
Not taking anything away from the Hawkeyes , as they have upped their game .

I will be very surprised if we don't see a very strong Panthers team bounce back at Waikaraka Park in March .

[tony27]

I agree with you there highrevz, to say that the panthers & tigers are done would be foolish. Next year & probably in Auckland next month they'll both more than likely be back to their best. Any team can have an off weekend
A lot of teams have improved in a big way, I think the number who have started teams racing outside of the 2 big meetings has helped them, the busters & hawkeyes home & away races for example.
I think the scrappers were possibly hurt in their lead up by the match up with the mustangs getting rained off, I think it would benefit both teams if they were able to arrange a home & away series as well rather than just having a one off race alternating tracks each year like happens with the tigers & panthers

[pfloyd]

i dont see why the panthers and mustangs dont race against each other more often. if there is one advantage that Palmy has but doesnt exploit it is the abundance of guys that want to teams race which should create plenty of competition. it doesnt have to be a car and driver damaging slugfest more of a tune up/ trial race at the beginning of a club night. it was done ealier this year for standard stocks. if you look at the mustangs they were disrupted by the rees and Joblin injuries and Kerry Humphreys temporary retirement and had no pre meeting race together at all and then we expected them to repeat last years heroics. The Panthers dont need personnel changes they just got one hell of a wake up call. its just a pity that call didnt come sooner. maybe if they had been smacked by Nelson earlier in the season they may have been a bit sharper ? as individuals most of them have had great results this year. no one doubts Rees' ability and if Miers is not interested he would hardly be spending a major amount of cash on a new car. this is the teams champs and nothing will ever go perfectly. they just had one of those meetings where more things went wrong than usual.As Steve Hansen says - flush that one down the toilet and move on.

[mcfly]

Feb 10, 2014 7:16:51 GMT 12 BarryB said:

I haven't witnessed the Panthers losing too many races over the years, certainly the Busters have been their nemisis at times but they didn't even meet this year, but what has usually happened in the past when the Panthers lose a race is that they immediately come back stronger than ever.....this time that did not happen. Aliens?


Let's do it on the terracotta,

Barry B

Aliens?? Or is there something in the rumour that SNZ were checking helmets for coms?
It certainly did appear that some really struggled to read a race as well as they have in the past!
Food for thought

[screaminV8]

Feb 10, 2014 15:57:07 GMT 12 mcfly said:

Feb 10, 2014 7:16:51 GMT 12 BarryB said:

I haven't witnessed the Panthers losing too many races over the years, certainly the Busters have been their nemisis at times but they didn't even meet this year, but what has usually happened in the past when the Panthers lose a race is that they immediately come back stronger than ever.....this time that did not happen. Aliens?


Let's do it on the terracotta,

Barry B

Aliens?? Or is there something in the rumour that SNZ were checking helmets for coms?
It certainly did appear that some really struggled to read a race as well as they have in the past!
Food for thought

With the spotter hiding behind the fence on the grassy knoll......

[Admin]

They did check as a result of a heads up about something that may or may not have happened at another teams meeting not involving the cars that were racing this weekend. It was decided that it was prudent they do spot checks to rule out the possibility of anything underhand happening.

[SKDKNG]

Maybe the massive tent relaxed them to much haha

[tank11]

Seriously, do you really think someone could sway a whole team to CHEAT by using head sets?

You are talking about 6 drivers to be convinced that it is RIGHT, then their crews.

And hangers on after that.

Yes kids in ministocks have been known to use their cell phones, but that's anther story.

[craig]

Feb 10, 2014 20:08:19 GMT 12 Admin said:

They did check as a result of a heads up about something that may or may not have happened at another teams meeting not involving the cars that were racing this weekend. It was decided that it was prudent they do spot checks to rule out the possibility of anything underhand happening.

True, I received a phone call in the week between the NZ Stockcar Teams meeting & the week later re-try of the Teams finals night that the word on the street around Napier at the NZ Superstock champs was that the Canterbury Crushers Stockcar team were using radio coms....I nearly fell off the seat laughing....we could hardly afford to return to compete the following week let alone invest in radio coms....or maybe we quickly sold them on trademe to afford to return? Like all rumours until its official it aint true....lol

As for the changing of the guard...yep, I think this meeting has seen a change for sure...sitting there watching the grand parade both nights we were amazed at the young guys now teams racing. Not just from one or two teams but pretty much across the board.
Its great to see & ensures the teams type meetings are here to stay for a while yet.

Gawd its bad that I can remember Carl Hodge as a young kid (maybe around 5 - I'm sure younger though) when we (Colin Cameron & I) went to Auckland to crew for (a cantabrian at heart) Gary Ellis when he raced in the Auckland Teams champs for Waikato(?) many many moons ago 
Now look at Carl...to me the the stand out driver of the 2014 meeting.

[ricardo63]

Feb 10, 2014 15:57:07 GMT 12 mcfly said:

Feb 10, 2014 7:16:51 GMT 12 BarryB said:

I haven't witnessed the Panthers losing too many races over the years, certainly the Busters have been their nemisis at times but they didn't even meet this year, but what has usually happened in the past when the Panthers lose a race is that they immediately come back stronger than ever.....this time that did not happen. Aliens?


Let's do it on the terracotta,

Barry B

Aliens?? Or is there something in the rumour that SNZ were checking helmets for coms?
It certainly did appear that some really struggled to read a race as well as they have in the past!
Food for thought

Now that is just being down right naughty mcfly. That is the best conspiracy theory over the past week or so I've read. Well done but I'm not sure that is going to fly to much...

[ricardo63]

Feb 10, 2014 13:44:58 GMT 12 @highrevz said:

Simple answer to this thread = NO . The Panthers preparations to this event were disrupted by the loss of Peter Rees .
Many were saying last week that one man doesn't make a team , well when it comes to the Panthers the loss of Rees obviously effects their performance .Rees is the kingpin of the Panthers and has shown in the past that he is capable of winning a teams race on his own. Having two cars sent off last weekend was the undoing of the Panthers and they never looked up from there .
There is no guarantee that the Hawkeyes would have won the race if the two Panthers cars were still on the track .
Not taking anything away from the Hawkeyes , as they have upped their game .

I will be very surprised if we don't see a very strong Panthers team bounce back at Waikaraka Park in March .

Hi highrev. Yes they won't have to wait long before to prove the theory is correct or wrong. I hope Peter R is back to full fitness so we get an exact marker of where we are at. There is no doubt that his presents was sorely missed & a man of his quality doesn't come along everyday, well unless your his son!!!! I just hope that a few more teams turn up this year so that will also have to be taken into account.