commentary (Read 6,449 times)

[superstock]

We were a bit spoilt in Wellington

[petero]

well from the comments in another thrtead it would seem so.

The positive comments about the commentary at Wellington were ongoing to say the least.
it made the meeting and then sum, let alone what we actually saw on the track.

The bar was set at Wellington however saying that, we are used to that at Rotorua and where tracks put the extra effort in

[Aaron Drever]

It can't of been that bad?? I only tuned into the last race which made no sense. I have said it before but is it time we have specialist commentators for these major events......

Thoughts?

[darrenpsych]

I was there both nights. The racing was 10/10, excellent value for $20 a night, no complaints.
However the commentary was dire. I have no doubt that Mr Birdling has done a massive amount for Nelson Speedway and speedway in general, long may he continue to do so, but he must retire from commentating. The same old mother in law jokes and in the bigger meetings he consistently makes error after error. Maybe the data he is fed is too confusing, I don't know the stress he works under but on both nights I had to explain to 'new' fans what was happening as very little info was coming via the commentary. He also insists on using driver names during the race, but the cars have numbers not names, people around me and myself on occasion, had no idea who he was referring to. Being told Taniwha or Asher Rees was in the lead meant nothing to the casual fans of which there were many. I think those around me went home knowing they had seen something good but were not sure what it all meant or who had won.

For the Streetstocks teams race there was no info provided. People thought they were already racing when it was just the practice laps!
Were there issues with sound on both nights, definitely seemed to be long periods of silence on turn two and the back 'straight'.
Also the on-field, centre commentary has been too quiet for the last three meetings now. The guy in the middle knows what he is talking about and I love to hear what he has to say, shame most of it gets missed. People really had to strain to hear the driver responses before picking their marble on Saturday.

To finish on a positive note can the man in the middle do the whole night as the main commentator, moved upstairs if necessary, he's much better. Either 1 or 2 meetings ago there was someone different doing the main commentary, it was much better, stick with him.

[BarryB]

I'm extremely loath to comment on commentators or commentary, but to be fair I think perhaps Nelson needed one or two more mics in operation at the weekend, but it all comes at a cost obviously. When comparing with Wellington the weekend before, the information flow was definitely better at the Superstocks. But then they used as many as six commentators, four main ones (Paul Hickey, Mal Sines, Mintie and Ramjam), while I heard Todd Moffat and I think another local guy at intermittment times as well. All played their part.

I think for a really big meeting (anything with 4-6 groups for qualifying, as both of these were), you arguably need four people minimun to do the event justice. That can depend a little on where the commentary box is in relation to the pits etc however, and also how good your backroom staff is at delivering results in a format that both the commentator and fans require. Rotorua has been the leader in the latter for years and years, just as a matter of interest, and accordingly can get away with 2-3 commentators at their biggest shows.

But normally, the 4 mentioned would basically be split into two upstairs, as epecicially on the first night of such meetings it's wall to wall paperwork with grids, results, points & qualifiers which is too much for one person, who is also calling races, to be able to assemble, read in a way acceptable to those following the points, and analyse. It also means, with a second person upstairs, there is always somebody free to chase missing information. The other two voices would be on roving mics, essentially one on the infield and the other mainly in the pits, but they cannot be a fixture anywhere. The emphasis on roving is to be where the story is.

For a normal night, 1-2 is fine, but fans expect more these days for events of the magnitude of those staged at Te Marua and Nelson over the past two weekends. From all reports, Wellington succeded in meeting or surpassing those expectations, whereas Nelson may have fallen a little short it appears. One thing I have learnt is that an "NZ championship crowd" is very different in their expectations from a "club night" or Demo Derby type crowd. The latter is full of once-a-year type people, who only go to watch a few races and often leave before the Feature race(s) because they're just passing the time, don't understand what they're watching and don't really care either. The former is jam packed with the sport's more knowledgeable fans, those that often travel to that particular class's title year after year after year. They know what they want, and they're peeved if they don't get it.

Barry B

[Admin]

There was much more wrong with the quality of the commentating at Nelson than what would have been fixed by having another voice or two on hand.

A single lead commentator who understood what the meeting was about and how it worked would have made all the difference for the customers.

[meeaneemic]

At Meeanee we employ Ian who's job it is to purely supply me with the grids, points, help run competitions etc on any given race night meaning I can just concentrate on my job.
For larger meetings we use a second announcer which is plenty for the way our track is laid out.
At the recent North Island Superstock champs I did the announcing on my own but because we have Ian the Public never went without the info they craved.

[gregobro]

It was a pretty hard listen, although some locals sitting behind me loved the Boom Boom Dad jokes so its always a hard call. I don't care how good you are or have been, this title is beyond a one person commentary team, even with old Ces Blazey on the infield. I could barely hear him so for us it was a one person mic team. I think his name was Browny and I thought Barry was in the building but alas no. There were some glaring errors and how many different versions of Andrew Dodunski's name did we get - thank gawd Steve Pribicevich wasn't entered! But as I say, I don't know how he held it all together working solo in that sauna, it can't have been easy.

[Deleted]

Ces Blazey on the infield - hahahhaha Now that right there is funny. I now have a mental image of ole Ces B running round the infield, big black glasses falling off his nose.

[racin14a]

Two years ago at the NZ super stocks we had to put up with him trying to get Steve's name correct and the amount of times he would use "race fans" in his commentary drive us crazy,

[BarryB]

Jan 12, 2015 13:52:00 GMT 12 racin14a said:

Two years ago at the NZ super stocks we had to put up with him trying to get Steve's name correct and the amount of times he would use "race fans" in his commentary drive us crazy,

To be fair though that's one #@#@ of a surname when you first see it, and I am guilty of calling him "Stevie P" myself earlier on to avoid getting tongue-tied with Pribicevich. Think I've got it sussed now though (practice, practice, practice, in time for the W240'S this weekend in case there's a test).

When you don't see or say some of these surnames (and some first names for that matter) regularly it can be tough. Most of us NI commentators were berated by an emerging Dale Ewers when he first raced up north many moons ago, as he had to correct us on the proper pronounciation of his surname.

Barry B

[wog]

After what was an awesome weekend of racing and a lot of good positive feedback about how the New Zealand Stockcar Championship was run here in Nelson it dis heartens me to read the negative comments on this website about the commentary. First of all (as the other thread has been closed)Dave never knew that the live audio feed was in action as we had it disconnected a few meetings back due to a technical glitch and so thought he was commentating to the local crowd not the whole world via the Internet. Commentating to a crowd that are there watching and commentating to an invisible crowd are two different things. Dave is a life member and has won awards for his commentating in the past and like myself and everyone else here at Prokarts Top Of The South Speedway is a volunteer. Yes we might of paid some other people to come in and take over for the weekend but then how would you like it if you were doing a job and on one of the biggest nights of your career and your boss turned around and bought someone else in? Think about that. Not that we thought of doing that for a second!!

The live stream audio is set up by a third party and is not controlled by Dave, Myself or anyone else on our committee. Dave has been the voice of our speedway for more years than I can remember and if his style of commentating is not to your liking then simply don't tune in. Not anywhere have I read that there is a standard for what a track has to supply the public in the way of information that they have to give to a crowd, nor should there be. Talking to Dave today he is as expected pretty disappointed in the comments that have been aired in such a public forum and I don't blame him. Personal attacks or comments should not be aired on a public forum like this one. If you have a problem then call Dave himself or the club and we can talk about it through the right channels. I personally back Dave 100%.

I would like to think that this thread is locked before any more damage is done to the sport we love as well.

Wayne Martin
President
Nelson Speedway Association

[BarryB]

Wog, I agree with you on the difference between commentating to the on-track crowd as opposed to the invisible crowd, and said so in the locked thread. A track announcer, to my way of thinking, only has an obligation to those that have paid to get in, not those tuning in by way of a free live audio stream.

However, I think you've overreacted on some other points, and there's nothing that has been said, to this point, that make this thread worthy of locking IMHO - I stand to be corrected on that if I've missed something.

Most North Island tracks do bring in outside commentators at major meetings (and have been doing so for the past 20 odd years, including some bringing in Dave himself) but NONE that I know of replace the existing commentator, they are merely brought in to assist as there's so much more that needs to be relayed at a meeting of such magnitude that it's too much for one person to do adequately, no matter how good they are. And Dave Birdling is one of the best, history tells us that, as does knowing him and listening to him for over 20 years. It's about helping, working as a team, not taking over. Commentary is a big part of any big event, and we've all been smashed by the critics at some point in time.

Also, personal attacks will not be tolerated here, but comments will. It's a discussion board and people are entitled to their opinion, even if we don't personally agree with it. Many of us have learned a lot through constructive criticism over the years, and as much as we may not like it at times we are not a country that bans people from voicing their opinion. Je Suis Charlie.

Barry B

[my2cents]

People say the commentary in Wellington was Fantastic. I have no idea as there was no commentary via internet availble. People complain about Nelson commentary I thought it was great sitting in my lounge in Christchurch.

People (at the track) say the commentary in Wellington was Fantastic. Question??? How much did you pay to get a seat??
People (at the track) complain about Nelson commentary. Question??? How much did you pay to get a seat??

So $$ for $$ where was the issue???

My 2 cents worth (altho an ex Nelson resident and still a Nelson supporter)

[Admin]

Jan 12, 2015 17:04:12 GMT 12 my2cents said:

People say the commentary in Wellington was Fantastic. I have no idea as there was no commentary via internet availble. People complain about Nelson commentary I thought it was great sitting in my lounge in Christchurch.

People (at the track) say the commentary in Wellington was Fantastic. Question??? How much did you pay to get a seat??
People (at the track) complain about Nelson commentary. Question??? How much did you pay to get a seat??

So $$ for $$ where was the issue???

My 2 cents worth (altho an ex Nelson resident and still a Nelson supporter)

Sorry you don't get it either . most of the comments came from people who were at the track or relayed from people who were at the track.
The other comments come from people who have been around long enough to know whether a job is well done or not.

Forget that it was live on the internet , it matters not that it was. This was a national event with plenty of national interest. 

All things about a national event needs to be a step up from what is the local norm.

The commentary at any meeting is a public performance open to critique (or praise as seen with the wellington Superstock meeting). 

[screaminV8]

I have to say myself and a number of others fully expected this debate to flare up after the weekend.

I know feedback can be hard to take when it's perceived as negative, but none of the above seems overly harsh or personal.
We as spectators had numerous discussions on it today, and agreed basically the following:

# commentary team needs to be beefed up for a meeting this big ie an assistant to focus on collating points etc
# roving mic's for infield and pits - volume up!
# a plan in advance ie when to read the finalists and in what order, when to read points out (and let spectators know) etc.

Those few little tweaks and it would have been great. Overall a fantastic meeting.

[SpeedwayLive]

We love the fact we can share both "ListenLive" and "LiveLaps" with people that cant make it track side ...

Like Wayne Martin said "it dis heartens me to read the negative comments on this website about the commentary" we too get dis hearten and frustrated by the negativity by a select few ... Its the crowd at the track that must come first ...

The comments also reflects badly on us and tracks start to question why they should bother ...

Its a privilege not a right that tracks allow this ...

REMEMBER: It's a lot easier to turn off than to build up the trust to turn it on ...

Cheers
Jason

[Admin]

Sorry Jason but it's not really about the live feed. Read the comments again and most are from people who were there. The people the commentary was aimed at.

Somehow this has become focused on the live feed, possibly because it's an easy out.

I suggest reading the posts again, all of mine were from txts received from trackside.

[meeaneemic]

I'm not so sure I agree that a track announcer is just there for those who have paid to get in.
Sure they are your main obligation but I think it is fantastic that we can entertain thousands more in cyber space at the same time.
Meeanee's meetings are all streamed now thanks to the brilliant efforts of SpeedwayLive and I am currently working out a system to include the live streamers {within NZ} in some of our Competition giveaways that we run.
Streaming is also an on going advertisment for your track and the better it looks/sounds the more chance of punters coming to have a look during the season.

I believe there should be criteria for big meetings regarding commentators etc even going as far to say it should be in the SNZ rules and regs of certain events.

[Admin]

Yes at the very least I've thought the live feeds to be potentially a good way of adding value for track/event sponsors especially national companies. It also can help keep your locals in the loop on the nights they can't attend for what ever reason .

Tracks do need to work with it more and then it will work for the tracks.