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Post by BarryB on Jan 25, 2024 9:55:23 GMT 12
Would have been a New Zealand Modified Sprint title back when that was a national class Mini-sprints originated in the South Island (Ellesmere mid 70's), ironically Modified-sprints originated in the North Island  There is a big dose of irony there!! Barry B |
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Post by openwheelfan01 on Jan 25, 2024 11:37:28 GMT 12
Agree with you there. winning NZ Title is never easy prospect, especially with competiton, and young drivers whom doing so incredibly well this season. Still say PIckens Must start as favourite given his momentum over Christmas/New Year period winning 4 out of 6 races.. Against former 2x Usac Champion Buddy Kofoid amongst others. even going back end of last seasons wins Ruapuna for Midget Gp and BT 4 mates. Format again looks like 5 heat races over 2 nights Accumulating points one off final over 30 laps. As a spectator I hate this format , and as nothing is decided I can’t see the point of going the first night I don’t think accurate data would exist , but I’d love to know if first night attendance for the tracks is down when this format is run i wouldnt imagine you'd get packed stadium when your paying $30 per night witness just few races. Tbh i dont know why cant have format 4 prelim heats 10 laps each top 4 go into 3 race championship final have 2 B mains taking top2 have field of 20 cars. 20 laps each front middle and back over 3 races top points scorers will settle the grids for 30 lap Final. at present have 5 groups seeded your in different group only going race them once in addition to Final. really best way to decide national championship ? |
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Post by midway on Jan 25, 2024 12:13:35 GMT 12
Over the years formats and qualifying have been bought into the sport ,and gone of the days it was the best race team who over 3 heats and then the final won on the night ..I thought there was more excitement for every one concerned then than there is now over two nights ,but you have to accept change i guess .
This meeting clashes with a entertaining meeting in the North Island ,which as a hardcore fan i dont like to miss
Come finals night i hope Ruapuna can put on a good track ,but some how it will become a little dusty and go slick and catch a few up against the cushion .
I will put a shilling on MOSEN ,AND A COUPLE OF PENNIES ON PICKENS ,and Honey bee oops Bell ..good luck ..
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Post by percy on Jan 25, 2024 12:29:23 GMT 12
Seems my memory is failing in my old age and indeed Minisprints were in the South Island (and a number of titles held at Ruapuna)
Thanks to everyone who corrected my error
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Post by BarryB on Jan 25, 2024 12:29:53 GMT 12
Over the years formats and qualifying have been bought into the sport ,and gone of the days it was the best race team who over 3 heats and then the final won on the night ..I thought there was more excitement for every one concerned then than there is now over two nights ,but you have to accept change i guess . This meeting clashes with a entertaining meeting in the North Island ,which as a hardcore fan i dont like to miss Come finals night i hope Ruapuna can put on a good track ,but some how it will become a little dusty and go slick and catch a few up against the cushion . I will put a shilling on MOSEN ,AND A COUPLE OF PENNIES ON PICKENS ,and Honey bee oops Bell ..good luck .. I think, from a major title standpoint, it's a very fair format from the angle of the competitors. From a spectator's point of view not so much. You're only guaranteed one full field all weekend, and that race could be a sizzler or it could be a cold pork chop. The one advantage this format does have is that the main protagonists for the title have to come together on the racetrack. With a 3-Heat final the runner up may not actually race side by side with the winner all night. That aspect makes the one race final amazing. If you can sit through two nights of kitchen prep to get to that point. And even then the main course can still disappoint. The great driver generally still come out on top regardless of the format being used. |
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Post by BarryB on Jan 25, 2024 12:33:40 GMT 12
Seems my memory is failing in my old age and indeed Minisprints were in the South Island (and a number of titles held at Ruapuna) Thanks to everyone who corrected my error You can't use old age as an excuse so long as Sir Macgor and myself are still around. Age is relative. You're only a young buck!! |
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Post by openwheelfan01 on Jan 25, 2024 14:47:48 GMT 12
Seems my memory is failing in my old age and indeed Minisprints were in the South Island (and a number of titles held at Ruapuna) Thanks to everyone who corrected my error You can't use old age as an excuse so long as Sir Macgor and myself are still around. Age is relative. You're only a young buck!! When Richard Battersby won his 3 straight titles. . were they Modified sprints or mini sprints. am sure about 1994-95 season when class first came to light. |
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Post by openwheelfan01 on Jan 25, 2024 14:52:14 GMT 12
Over the years formats and qualifying have been bought into the sport ,and gone of the days it was the best race team who over 3 heats and then the final won on the night ..I thought there was more excitement for every one concerned then than there is now over two nights ,but you have to accept change i guess . This meeting clashes with a entertaining meeting in the North Island ,which as a hardcore fan i dont like to miss Come finals night i hope Ruapuna can put on a good track ,but some how it will become a little dusty and go slick and catch a few up against the cushion . I will put a shilling on MOSEN ,AND A COUPLE OF PENNIES ON PICKENS ,and Honey bee oops Bell ..good luck .. I think, from a major title standpoint, it's a very fair format from the angle of the competitors. From a spectator's point of view not so much. You're only guaranteed one full field all weekend, and that race could be a sizzler or it could be a cold pork chop. The one advantage this format does have is that the main protagonists for the title have to come together on the racetrack. With a 3-Heat final the runner up may not actually race side by side with the winner all night. That aspect makes the one race final amazing. If you can sit through two nights of kitchen prep to get to that point. And even then the main course can still disappoint. The great driver generally still come out on top regardless of the format being used. surely with the old format you would have pickens and Mosen racing in same heats. with this format way it's seeded broken up into groups. race them once in their groups then one off feature. least when you had 3 race final of front middle and back. be racing them all those heat races |
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Post by BarryB on Jan 25, 2024 15:31:30 GMT 12
I think, from a major title standpoint, it's a very fair format from the angle of the competitors. From a spectator's point of view not so much. You're only guaranteed one full field all weekend, and that race could be a sizzler or it could be a cold pork chop. The one advantage this format does have is that the main protagonists for the title have to come together on the racetrack. With a 3-Heat final the runner up may not actually race side by side with the winner all night. That aspect makes the one race final amazing. If you can sit through two nights of kitchen prep to get to that point. And even then the main course can still disappoint. The great driver generally still come out on top regardless of the format being used. surely with the old format you would have pickens and Mosen racing in same heats. with this format way it's seeded broken up into groups. race them once in their groups then one off feature. least when you had 3 race final of front middle and back. be racing them all those heat races When they ran the 3 qualifying races and then a 3 heat finals, two top guys like MP & Mosen would have been separated into different groups via seeding, in a bid to keep all groups equal talent-wise overall. The on the second night, over 3 heats, one could draw front/middle/rear versus rear/middle/front. So the only time they might see each other is in the middle heat. Drivers can be in the same group/race without actually really racing against each other. But should qualifying goes as expected, and it generally does for most top competitors under this format, the top 3 or 4 will be battling each other, and whichever one beats the others in the final race wins the chocolates. It's direct competition. The 3 heat final may not come down to the race Mosen and Pickens actually race each other side by side. Mosen could win that particular class, they'd both likely win the front grid start, so it would depend on who did best from the rear. Driving to finish 7th to win the title, because that's all he needs, isn't much of a spectacle either. That's why the one-race final is better in the non-contact classes. But as said before, it is at the cost of a night or weekend of full fields. The biggest benefit is that you're more than likely going to have the best in the class, racing head to head from the drop of the green (as opposed to one taking 14 of the 15 laps coming through the field to latch on to the other's tail tank). I wish there way to get the best of both worlds. Barry B |
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Post by openwheelfan01 on Jan 25, 2024 16:54:11 GMT 12
I know never be perfect solution which format is better. am recalling original one night finals of qualifying to make 3 race championship finals. if you got caught up someone elses mess unable to restart then your championship aspirations were over for the season needed to finish all 3 races when came down to points. even if you dont start side by side any of those 3 Championship finals. this format eliminates that. as example if pickens group 1 vs 2 which is mosen will race on that one race. then wont actually race against each other until one off final. basically depend on how the points over 5 heats of groups work out. no guarantee will face off front row.. groups are pretty much even, anybody can basically win it. i recall Hayden Williams when he failed to finish race at western springs had to start on grid 17. managed 3NZ after feature race conclusion. wonder if we had old format how it would have made difference. far i know Pickens won just 1 championship of his 10 through old format at Stratford.
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Post by BarryB on Jan 25, 2024 19:13:54 GMT 12
Yes, it's the "getting taken out in somebody else's accident" that can be the big spoiler when held over 3 heats. But no system is perfect. Some push for a season-long title with rounds held at many tracks, but that has never appealed to me. We're not Formula 1 or NASCAR. Many drivers would not be able to compete in every round.
I've always enjoyed travelling all over the country to see New Zealand titles determined for many classes on different tracks, but would not travel very far for 'a round of a championship'. Other people are different obviously, but however it's run it has to be attractive to race fans, as sponsors won't put the money up if the crowds stay home.
Barry B
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Post by sonic33 on Jan 25, 2024 20:50:08 GMT 12
Not a fan of mutiple heat races with less than full fields. This seems to be becoming the norm for non contact classes, hence I have stopped travelling as much for any titles that require me to sit through one or two nights to see one race with a full field. Plus, the quality of support classes seems to be sadly lacking, both in numbers, and decent classes.
One positive for a one race final for midgets is if a good driver has bad heat races there is a chance they can come from the back to win due to the insane amount of cautions this class seems to have when they do finally run in full numbers. The positive being a driver coming from the back, not the multiple cautions. haha
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Post by mod46c on Jan 26, 2024 6:28:01 GMT 12
Having just got back from the classic, from memory (two nights of qualifying) they run time trials to seeds the heats, then two heats (straight up, and reverse) of ~12 cars each, then C, B, and A main. The A main winner is locked in as top qualifier the rest are racked up on heat points. On finals night they have bronze silver and gold 'shot out' to set the final grids for the A main. Seemed to work pretty well, I can't recall sitting in the stand thinking this heat needs another 8 cars They don't really run a support class, the stock rods? are really there to work the track. This would be my preference, if I go to a sprintcar meeting I want to watch sprintcars, not saloon and definitely not stockcars |
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Post by speedwaynut on Jan 26, 2024 11:29:10 GMT 12
Everyone's preferences are different.
I dislike the time trials route. You see a car once in the time trial, and maybe once in an A main to find the grid positions, then in the main race. That's it.
At least in the two night format, you actually see cars race against each other. It gives you a picture of who is fast, who gets through traffic, and if someone has car issues one night, it doesn't necessarily mean they are out of the championship, if they can get their issues sorted on the second night.
I'm more than happy to fly from Auckland to Christchurch to watch the 2 night show for the NZ midget title.
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Post by openwheelfan01 on Jan 26, 2024 16:09:25 GMT 12
I dont think its possible ever run NZ title as season long Championship would be great just impossible when sports really Amateur level. notice many couldnt afford do each and every round really lose its point. on level playing field format used now probably best even if you dont see top drivers racing against each other much what we would like. Ie Pickens And Mosen likely race each other twice over 2 nights format. on the other hand does give more drivers opportunity strike problems able to be fixed. still that chance finish top 3.
when it comes NZ Midget titles have just 3 tracks appear to host these championships on regular basis are Western Springs, Stratford and Ruapuna.. even though Springs is listed i believe for 2025. does that mean goes back Stratford again or possible another track hadsnt hosted Midget title. if springs is no longer after 2024.
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Post by midway on Jan 26, 2024 16:37:25 GMT 12
There is a great depth of talent in this years championship ,the more you study the entry list . And watching them race at Baypark ,proved there is many that can be on the podium if the top contenders ,like the Chilli bowl incident with Pickens took place .. I can remember how Kerry Brocas scattered the pidgeons off there nest a few years back in the sprintcar champs You dont have to be a dark horse either ,even a old ED Pink Esslinger could come out on tops .. |
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Post by magilla on Jan 26, 2024 17:17:50 GMT 12
Yep 11 only from the Mainland at least they have a track to race on in Christchurch. Not like some weed ridden falling down once was an icon Stadium that know one cares about.Must be some enthusiasm from 26 competitors to come South and race.Perhaps its the fine weather on race weekends down here or knowing how their lamb rack got made before making its way to the dinner plate. do you need a cuddle mate but the stench of lanolin would be off putting to most no good having a race track when theres no one to racing on it  11 local entries for a nz title as prestigious as nz midgets is an embarrassment - it should have been handed back to snz and given to a north island track Ruapuna one of the best tracks in New Zealand. |
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Post by magilla on Jan 26, 2024 17:21:14 GMT 12
Agree with you there. winning NZ Title is never easy prospect, especially with competiton, and young drivers whom doing so incredibly well this season. Still say PIckens Must start as favourite given his momentum over Christmas/New Year period winning 4 out of 6 races.. Against former 2x Usac Champion Buddy Kofoid amongst others. even going back end of last seasons wins Ruapuna for Midget Gp and BT 4 mates. Format again looks like 5 heat races over 2 nights Accumulating points one off final over 30 laps. As a spectator I hate this format , and as nothing is decided I can’t see the point of going the first night I don’t think accurate data would exist , but I’d love to know if first night attendance for the tracks is down when this format is run that is a daft attitude. It is a great format as you get 15 heats of great racing because cars have to pass to gain points to make the final and set the grids for the final so every heat affects the final outcome. |
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Post by magilla on Jan 26, 2024 17:26:13 GMT 12
Seems my memory is failing in my old age and indeed Minisprints were in the South Island (and a number of titles held at Ruapuna) Thanks to everyone who corrected my error They even held NZ Minisprint and NZ Midget same weekend at Ruapuna 2001/02 |
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Post by NZ Sauber on Jan 26, 2024 18:48:18 GMT 12
When it comes NZ Midget titles have just 3 tracks appear to host these championships on regular basis are Western Springs, Stratford and Ruapuna.. even though Springs is listed i believe for 2025. does that mean goes back Stratford again or possible another track hadsnt hosted Midget title. if springs is no longer after 2024.   I can't speak to the Western Springs situation and how it would be dealt with but Baypark Speedway is next in the NZ title rotation. I have also pasted in the eligibility rules which a tracks needs to meet in order to receive the title. |
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