Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2011 1:23:12 GMT 12
how many ppl comenting here know the diffrence between the stipendiary steward and the refferee?
How many think they are one and the same
I would imagine the two answers are bugger all and bloody heaps.
we have a problem where we have a sport with some VERY complex rules and we (the fans) can't see or hear a ref calling a penalty or know what its for. It seems there were plenty of relegation's over the weekend and the nelson one was just one of them.
Bitter pill to swallow but...
@ Buster, When was the last time you saw a black flag used for anything, And if the ref was going to relegate one (or more) placings why would they black flag him. generally in teams racing a driver is never DQ'd. The driver is relegated or the team DQ'd. The reason for that is that if the ref DQ'd a driver but didn't stop the race to take him off, A driver who is no longer in the race can still have a effect on the outcome.
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Post by The Dark One on Feb 6, 2011 1:51:45 GMT 12
Ramjam, judging by the current theme of the posts in this thread, attempting to be the voice of reason will simply fall on deaf ears.
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Post by Tony on Feb 6, 2011 6:36:22 GMT 12
Ramjam, judging by the current theme of the posts in this thread, attempting to be the voice of reason will simply fall on deaf ears. Quite so DarkOne. I can understand that some Nelson fans are feeling bitter and twisted, but them's the breaks. The call was made, and that's the end of the story. It gives us something to talk about for years to come anyway. And as Basil noted, it's almost a mirror-image of Hemi's demotion in the first race last year. Had Hemi won that race, the Panthers wouldn't have met the Tigers in that infamous semi-final, and history might have been different. You can debate the what-ifs until the cows come home, but at the end of the day, the Tigers won last year and the Panthers won this year; it's now written in Teams Champs history. And of course, we'll all be back at Palmy next year so they can do it all over again! |
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Post by BarryB on Feb 6, 2011 7:11:19 GMT 12
just one of many questions  but why wait till after the race?? if it is a turn 1 lap 1 infringement why is he not black flagged immediately?? It was a relegation, not a disqualification |
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Post by BarryB on Feb 6, 2011 7:16:16 GMT 12
I should have added that in this case it was a relegation so not much else could be done I guess. It was a relegation that was lacking in any consistency at all in regards to the majority of races that were run this weekend. And, furthermore, according to the results posted on the race in question, a Nelson driver had also finished second, so should have been promoted to the top spot with Brett's relegation. A Nelson driver was second, but he was racing for Stratford |
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Post by youngone on Feb 6, 2011 7:31:10 GMT 12
So can someone please explain the difference between a referee and a stipendary steward?
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Post by penman on Feb 6, 2011 7:33:32 GMT 12
It was a relegation that was lacking in any consistency at all in regards to the majority of races that were run this weekend. And, furthermore, according to the results posted on the race in question, a Nelson driver had also finished second, so should have been promoted to the top spot with Brett's relegation. A Nelson driver was second, but he was racing for Stratford ;D ;D ;D....quite so Barry. Very good. |
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Post by Wildcat on Feb 6, 2011 7:38:47 GMT 12
It turned the final into a anti climax Due respect to to the Stratty boys ,they where on hiding to nothing They where never going to beat Parmy You know they would try their guts out ,and give it heaps .With the relegation or what ever of Nelson ,it took the battle of the year everone was expecting and wanted to see,turning it into a bit of a fizzer and a expensive one for the fearless Stratty boys  |
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Post by oppositelock on Feb 6, 2011 7:44:18 GMT 12
so was brett way on the grass or was he just touching it?? when he passed the cars at the start?? guess we will find out how bad it was in the replay on speedbox then we can all see if it was the right call or not.
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Post by penman on Feb 6, 2011 7:47:21 GMT 12
so was brett way on the grass or was he just touching it?? when he passed the cars at the start?? guess we will find out how bad it was in the replay on speedbox then we can all see if it was the right call or not. That's what I'm waiting to see too,,,,and to see whether it had an impact on the overall result, given the fact the cars in front of him were cramping each other up aganst the wall. I hope I don't have to eat humble pie after this - because humble pie is ever worse than speedway pie!  |
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Post by Racerman on Feb 6, 2011 7:51:20 GMT 12
So can someone please explain the difference between a referee and a stipendary steward? G7-1 SENIOR OFFICIALS G7-1-1 Stipendiary Steward: An official appointed by the Directors to assist, advise, or supervise SNZ Stewards in the carrying out of their duties, and if necessary assume control. G7-1-2 There will be at least one Stipendiary Steward in the South Island and at least two Stipendiary Stewards in the North Island. 2010 ELECTRONIC RULEBOOK 43 G7-1-3 At any meeting where a Stipendiary Steward has been requested or sent by the Directors, he shall be in supreme control of the Meeting. G7-1-4 Stipendiary Stewards may fine up to $300, exclude any competitor, SNZ Official, or any person the Clerk of the Course is responsible for, and crew members under competitors responsibility, for up to six weeks from the night or day in question, except as laid down in Section G11-3 Technical Exclusions. He may suspend any person or body under the jurisdiction of the by-laws of Speedway New Zealand, or pending such official inquiry, as he shall recommend to the Directors. This suspension to be effective from time of pronouncement until the findings of the Directors are advised in writing from the CEO or, if not available, the Chairman, to the defendant party. G7-1-5 The Stipendiary Steward imposing suspension will advise the Directors within 48 hours of his action. G7-1-6 Stipendiary Steward may declare a race or meeting concluded or completed, if in his opinion it would be unsafe for it to continue. He will advise the Steward and the Clerk of the Course of his intentions if for any reason verbal or otherwise indicated, a meeting or race will be in contravention of the by-laws of SNZ, a direction of SNZ, or a Stipendiary Steward. The Stipendiary Steward shall have the authority to instruct the Steward not to issue a permit, and advise the Clerk of the Course accordingly, he shall advise the Directors within 48 hours of this action. G7-1-7 Any competitor or party, under the authority of Speedway New Zealand may request the Stipendiary Steward to act as his advocate, at any inquiry or appeal meeting, giving the defendant competitor or party, the benefit of the Stipendiary Steward's experience, or they should be advised they may have an independent advocate. G7-4 Duties of a Referee G7-4-1 The Referee must confine his duties to refereeing and he must NOT undertake additional duties during a meeting. G7-4-2 A Referee may: 2010 ELECTRONIC RULEBOOK 48 (a) Issue a reprimand. (b) Fine up to $120 (One hundred and twenty dollars). Refer G11-2. Exception: Teams Racing (c) Exclude a competitor from a particular race or meeting for up to 15 days (starting from the day/night in question), from racing anywhere in New Zealand. (d) Relegate or promote race positions. G7-4-3 He controls the two-three minute bell as permitted in race regulations. G7-4-4 He will enforce all Regulations pertaining to the actual racing. G7-4-5 A Referee may, after consultation with the Clerk of the Course, recommend to the Steward that the meeting be postponed or abandoned in whole or part. G7-4-6 He shall start Motorcycle events if another starter has not been delegated in this position. Whosoever does the starting, will also operate the green light indicating a start is imminent. G7-4-7 UNLESS OTHERWISE PROVIDED IN THESE RULES, if an accident has occurred, and in the opinion of the Referee it would be dangerous for the race to continue, he shall have the race stopped by giving the stop signal, and the race shall then be re-run or re-started. The Referee and Steward only, are empowered to stop a race, and no other official shall initiate the `stop' signal during the course of a race. G7-4-8 He shall penalize immediately a competitor who, in his opinion, indulges in foul, unfair or dangerous conduct including any competitor who steers or drifts from his course in such a manner as to impede any competitor who may be attempting to pass or, in the case of a non-team event, jeopardizing the fair chance of one or more of the other competitors. G7-4-9 He must make himself conversant with the racing rules of the particular class/es racing at his track. G7-4-10 He shall be entitled to forbid the access to his box by any person during the meeting and nobody shall approach him without his permission. G7-4-11 A Referee has the duty to respect the right of drivers who consider themselves to be unjustly penalized, to expect a reasonable and courteous explanation. |
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Post by penman on Feb 6, 2011 7:56:10 GMT 12
G7-4-8 He shall penalize immediately a competitor who, in his opinion, indulges in foul, unfair or dangerous conduct including any competitor who steers or drifts from his course in such a manner as to impede any competitor who may be attempting to pass or, in the case of a non-team event, jeopardizing the fair chance of one or more of the other competitors.
Appears to be the section under scrutiny from last night...
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Post by Shai-tan on Feb 6, 2011 8:01:52 GMT 12
G7-4-8 He shall penalize immediately a competitor who, in his opinion, indulges in foul, unfair or dangerous conduct including any competitor who steers or drifts from his course in such a manner as to impede any competitor who may be attempting to pass or, in the case of a non-team event, jeopardizing the fair chance of one or more of the other competitors.Appears to be the section under scrutiny from last night... OMG LOL he must have used a non-contact ruling on the Tigers |
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Post by Gavin Stowers on Feb 6, 2011 8:04:59 GMT 12
Penman - I generally like reading your posts and tend to agree mostly with what you say. However please don't fall into that category of members who shout 'conspiracy' every time a decision is made that seems to weigh in favour of the Panthers.
Last year, things went very very differently and - as the likes of Basil and one other sound minded soul have commented - Wayne Hemi was relegated in exactly the same fashion. This saw the Panthers being stripped of their win and having to fight back, but meeting the Tigers in the semi, instead of the final.
Did I hear you shout 'conspiracy' then?
It would have been devastating for Brett [correction] - just as it was for Wayne last year. Wayne is quoted as saying how devastated he was at letting his team down on the 'Smash Hits' 60 Minutes episode.
In instances such as this, you have to look at the driver's actions. Yup, it's in the white hot heat of racing. Split decisions need to be made....pass inside or outside...But regardless if the decision you make whilst racing is a breach of the rules, then you have to take it on the chin.
That is what happened with Brett [correction] this year - and Wayne last year.
And I am sure that if you viewed both videos.....depending on where you stand....both were fair or tough calls.
But conspiracy?? Never.
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Post by penman on Feb 6, 2011 8:10:44 GMT 12
Penman - I generally like reading your posts and tend to agree mostly with what you say. However please don't fall into that category of members who shout 'conspiracy' every time a decision is made that seems to weigh in favour of the Panthers. Last year, things went very very differently and - as the likes of Basil and one other sound minded soul have commented - Wayne Hemi was relegated in exactly the same fashion. This saw the Panthers being stripped of their win and having to fight back, but meeting the Tigers in the semi, instead of the final. Did I hear you shout 'conspiracy' then? It would have been devastating for Blair - just as it was for Wayne last year. Wayne is quoted as saying how devastated he was at letting his team down on the 'Smash Hits' 60 Minutes episode. In instances such as this, you have to look at the driver's actions. Yup, it's in the white hot heat of racing. Split decisions need to be made....pass inside or outside...But regardless if the decision you make whilst racing is a breach of the rules, then you have to take it on the chin. That is what happened with Blair this year - and Wayne last year. And I am sure that if you viewed both videos.....depending on where you stand....both were fair or tough calls. But conspiracy?? Never. But, but, but....  I....er.... Wayne...um....and Brett (not Blair)...er... Ah...oh... *wanders to kitchen to get out knife and fork....and a plate* |
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panthrmac
Full Member
It's the year of the "P"
Posts: 241
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Post by panthrmac on Feb 6, 2011 8:14:32 GMT 12
Hey Penman
We all know it wasn't the final we wanted to see but as it has been stated in teams racing sometimes the calls don't always go your way...PN had it last year and this same forum went beserk then too!!!!
And mate I told you on Friday night it's the year of the "P"
Cheers
W
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Post by wayspeed on Feb 6, 2011 8:15:24 GMT 12
As a teams fan ,but with no track allegiance , Palmy did to Stratford, what Nelson did to Palmy last year destroyed the opposition. The 2 top teams over the last 2 nights where Palmy and Nelson, so was highly pissed not to see them race each other.
Have to wait another 12 months
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Post by penman on Feb 6, 2011 8:19:23 GMT 12
Hey Penman We all know it wasn't the final we wanted to see but as it has been stated in teams racing sometimes the calls don't always go your way...PN had it last year and this same forum went beserk then too!!!! And mate I told you on Friday night it's the year of the "P" Cheers W Yes, yes...I know. I shall file it away in my 'never to be looked at again' file, along with the pictures Ramjam sent me of him in a speedo and my personally autographed copy of the The Greg Louganis story. And it's the Year Of The Rabbit. Rabbits hop on the grass all the time right? |
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Post by penman on Feb 6, 2011 8:21:21 GMT 12
As a teams fan ,but with no track allegiance , Palmy did to Stratford, what Nelson did to Palmy last year destroyed the opposition. The 2 top teams over the last 2 nights where Palmy and Nelson, so was highly pissed not to see them race each other. Have to wait another 12 months And I think "destroyed the opposition" is somewhat of an understatement. Ouch! |
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Post by Tony on Feb 6, 2011 8:38:37 GMT 12
You're right Penman; "annihilated" might be a better fit ...
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