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Post by chris13w on Nov 5, 2009 21:13:24 GMT 12
Coming back to this rule - have you measured up any tyres yet to see if its a problem Tony? I don't have any mounted up on rims so can't check any of mine. Seems that its measuring the bulge in the sidewall though, so as long as you've got 30-40 psi in them when you measure them I guess anything will comply?? It's how I car comes off a track that is critical, not in the pits prior. 104 x 17 x 15 tyre on a 14" saloon rim at 9 pound = 18 3/4" overall tyre width off car. Circumference approx 103" Tread 16 1/2" The above at 4lb 101" circumference. So if you could buy ex USA a 98/99 x 17 x 15 you would enjoy a significant advantage on a slick track, or any track if you engine had the grunt to turn it! But my understanding has always been that the tyre must also have a dimension not more that 100-14 x 15 moulded into the tyre? (Or no more that 31.5 for tyres rated by height) By the way Murray, saw in that video you posted (where you got illegally jumped by someone who doesn't understand following Indian file...) that you ended up losing a right rear - so does that mean you're buying a beadlock now instead of the handful of roofing screws?! |
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Post by 98wsaloon on Nov 5, 2009 21:25:45 GMT 12
your understanding me murray...yeh chris used to be 14" but seams its been replaced by the new measuring rule.again forcing the budget class to spend more if they want to be in the ball park with the big spenders.if those tyres can now be used really everybody will need them.
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Post by nzf2stocks. on Nov 5, 2009 21:38:01 GMT 12
If you allow 2nd hand Super Saloon tyres (104") you allow new tyres, as those with the budget wil get someone with a super or mod etc to do one lap then sell them, so those with the big budgets, big horsepower will be further in front of the budget racer. If you want to control the budget, control the grip; change the rule to a smaller tyre, not larger, that way those with less horsepower but better setup and skill will have a better chance of keeping up.
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Post by chris13w on Nov 5, 2009 21:40:20 GMT 12
Of course you could always go the other way and run tiny tyres... Like the Late model running at Baypark last year that was running 92-11 x 15 Right Rears...   Mind you - it looked stupid and handled like crap... |
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Post by 98wsaloon on Nov 5, 2009 21:43:07 GMT 12
check out the hoosiers on macgors parts chris 96x15x15 ,measure up to 98_99" perfect
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 5, 2009 21:45:34 GMT 12
Iff you look in the old rule book the same rule is there T11-2-12 c . A 14 inch tyre on a 14 inch rim measures appox 19 inches at stub axle height so whats the problem? As for rule changes did you go to your remit meeting and vote?
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Post by chris13w on Nov 5, 2009 21:49:45 GMT 12
check out the hoosiers on macgors parts chris 96x15x15 ,measure up to 98_99" perfect I haven't checked the details in the new rule book - but if its got 96x15x15 moulded on it - is it now OK? As I'm sure before it couldn't say more that 14" on the tyres? |
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Post by 98wsaloon on Nov 5, 2009 21:52:15 GMT 12
i cant find any thing that states that chris. .i was hopeing someboby from tec would answer thats why i posted
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Post by nzf2stocks. on Nov 5, 2009 21:55:12 GMT 12
You're right it does look stupid, but late models always do ;D. I know its a dirty word but a 'control' right rear would bring the relative speeds closer, making budgets less important. In recent years the differences between Super Saloons and Saloons have been disapearing, wide fives, quick changes yada yada, so now the only real difference is the engines and tyres. Setup will negate the tyre difference and money is closing the gap in horsepower and responce. In combined fields the top Saloons can deal to all but the best of the supers. So whats next for the rule changes, 406 engines so you can buy 2nd hand American late model engines? The rules that have been changed were for good reasons, I'm just not sure that the end result will be what you want, a class where you can be competitive on a smaller budget. I have a suspicion that vested interests want a merging of the Saloon classes and they are slowly acheiving that, then you will have two classes still, the haves and have nots.
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Post by chris13w on Nov 5, 2009 21:55:50 GMT 12
Iff you look in the old rule book the same rule is there T11-2-12 c . A 14 inch tyre on a 14 inch rim measures appox 19 inches at stub axle height so whats the problem? As for rule changes did you go to your remit meeting and vote? I sure did - and I know Wellington didn't vote for ANY of the new rules - because I wrote down our responses to the remits Like I said, and have said in posts at the time - special interest group of about half a dozen from some of the northern tracks got together and rigged up the rules (and votes) for what they wanted to see - bye bye $5 mirrors and $100 weight jackers... come on in expensive bead lock wheels!! But did they think to make the tyre choice cheaper - of course not! |
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 5, 2009 21:56:03 GMT 12
It has never said that always been 14 in rim and the overall width just been out and measured our r/r 18 and a half inches 96/15/15 tyre so they are fine cheap to $180. Find a 104 for that money
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Post by 98wsaloon on Nov 5, 2009 22:00:21 GMT 12
i bet if we can run that size they wont stay 180 bucks for long,they are that price cause nobody wants them. the size most run now are more expensive than a 104 to buy.
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 5, 2009 22:04:01 GMT 12
Was at the Edge on Tuesday they have sold over 150 of them so someone must be buying them
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Post by 98wsaloon on Nov 5, 2009 22:07:51 GMT 12
must be open wheelers then,sure aint supers or saloons,my mistake,.
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Post by chris13w on Nov 5, 2009 22:09:31 GMT 12
You're right it does look stupid, but late models always do ;D. I know its a dirty word but a 'control' right rear would bring the relative speeds closer, making budgets less important. In recent years the differences between Super Saloons and Saloons have been disapearing, wide fives, quick changes yada yada, so now the only real difference is the engines and tyres. Setup will negate the tyre difference and money is closing the gap in horsepower and responce. In combined fields the top Saloons can deal to all but the best of the supers. So whats next for the rule changes, 406 engines so you can buy 2nd hand American late model engines? The rules that have been changed were for good reasons, I'm just not sure that the end result will be what you want, a class where you can be competitive on a smaller budget. I have a suspicion that vested interests want a merging of the Saloon classes and they are slowly acheiving that, then you will have two classes still, the haves and have nots. That is partially true - "back to the future" as it were - as in the old days you only had "saloons" - which encompassed everything from a 1275cc Mini to a fuel injected 406... But that wasn't that great either... My view is that the cars SHOULD all be the same - with the difference being just the engine, fuel and gearbox. That way its easy to change from one class to another, you could step up to Supers, or step down to Saloons and all you need to change is the engine/gearbox/fuel package. After all, part of the reason a Saloon costs so much now is that you would never build a "Saloon", what would be the point - so you built a Super then just down spec the running gear. Mind you - I've said the same about other classes too - what we should do is have two specs of engines and run them across lots of classes: Full on race engine (sprint car type) - goes into: - Sprint cars - Super Saloons - Superstocks!!! Limited type engine (saloon spec - 350cu, OEM heads, 650 carb) - Modifieds - Saloons - Stockcars Think how simple the rules would be! Think how standard the engine builds would be!! You could then even bring in a "claimer" engine rule for the limited class - spend more than $XXXX and you could lose it on an engine claim... Never happen of course - SNZ rules can't be changed radically because of the vested interest voting system... |
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 5, 2009 22:10:15 GMT 12
I would say 90% of Saloons in the south island are running them
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Post by chris13w on Nov 5, 2009 22:11:58 GMT 12
I would say 90% of Saloons in the south island are running them But 90% of saloons in the South Island are A grades aren't they? So they could run 104's anyway... |
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Post by 98wsaloon on Nov 5, 2009 22:12:37 GMT 12
were a bit backward up here ;D
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 5, 2009 22:21:21 GMT 12
There is approx 20 Saloons in the south Island
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Post by chris13w on Nov 5, 2009 22:25:53 GMT 12
You should ask for a South Island title then!
Having that would probably convince a few more A Grades to change over as well??
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