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Post by grindingdisc on Jan 19, 2024 18:40:53 GMT 12
Not at all you are stuck in the middle of the pack 2 races in a row
Hard to get a clean run when that happens high chance of damage
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Post by Ramjam on Jan 19, 2024 18:41:21 GMT 12
I'd be pissed off if i traveled the length of the country to race in this event Anyone who travels the length of the country to get to Rotorua would have such a poor sense of direction that they'd be lucky to find turn 3, so would have trouble qualifying anyway 🤣🤣
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Post by keyboardracer on Jan 19, 2024 18:44:40 GMT 12
Not at all you are stuck in the middle of the pack 2 races in a row Hard to get a clean run when that happens high chance of damage But how's it any different to front/rear? You still have the same amount of cars to pass no matter what your grid positions are over the 2 heats
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Post by tiroto on Jan 19, 2024 18:45:27 GMT 12
Showers forecast in the morning then clearing. How much time does Stan need to get the track ready? Meeanee resurrected the track by putting a layer of gravel over the track and steamrollering it in. It saved the meeting. While I'm not an expert in track prep I've watched Stan many times at the Valley of Paradise and it is an art form. You do need time. I'd rather watch 10 superstock races on a fantastic track (no pressure Stan) rather than a rushed prepared track and 18 superstock races. It certainly is cut throat with only 2 races to qual and there will be some top drivers who miss out.
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Post by grindingdisc on Jan 19, 2024 18:49:15 GMT 12
Not at all you are stuck in the middle of the pack 2 races in a row Hard to get a clean run when that happens high chance of damage But how's it any different to front/rear? You still have the same amount of cars to pass no matter what your grid positions are over the 2 heats Once you progress from being a keyboard racer to real life racer you will learn
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Post by grindingdisc on Jan 19, 2024 18:53:28 GMT 12
Showers forecast in the morning then clearing. How much time does Stan need to get the track ready? Meeanee resurrected the track by putting a layer of gravel over the track and steamrollering it in. It saved the meeting. While I'm not an expert in track prep I've watched Stan many times at the Valley of Paradise and it is an art form. You do need time. I'd rather watch 10 superstock races on a fantastic track (no pressure Stan) rather than a rushed prepared track and 18 superstock races. It certainly is cut throat with only 2 races to qual and there will be some top drivers who miss out. The track did appear good for the 2nd half of the night at meeanee Gravel does sound rather concerning though?? I think i would rather be hit in the face by a ball of mud than i would a stone!! If this is true do you know what grade of gravel? I am really suprised speedway nz allowed this to be honest, the track will need to be relayed and all the stones screened out of it
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Post by keyboardracer on Jan 19, 2024 18:54:19 GMT 12
But how's it any different to front/rear? You still have the same amount of cars to pass no matter what your grid positions are over the 2 heats Once you progress from being a keyboard racer to real life racer you will learn So you are admitting there's no difference and no matter what grid positions you get, over a 2 heat format it's all down to who passes the most cars whether that's front-rear, middle-middle, or in between. Use logic, not juvenile insults please.
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Post by grindingdisc on Jan 19, 2024 18:58:42 GMT 12
Once you progress from being a keyboard racer to real life racer you will learn So you are admitting there's no difference and no matter what grid positions you get, over a 2 heat format it's all down to who passes the most cars whether that's front-rear, middle-middle, or in between. Use logic, not juvenile insults please. Read my reply the first time so i dont have to repeat it for you… Its hard to get a clean run when you and sandwiched in the middle of the pack 2 races in a row very high chance of getting a dnf… Did you see the repocharge at stratford?? Or ever watched any first corner freight trians You would rather be at the back or the front everytime
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Post by BarryB on Jan 19, 2024 19:00:50 GMT 12
Not at all you are stuck in the middle of the pack 2 races in a row Hard to get a clean run when that happens high chance of damage Even over three heats, some drivers prefer a grid draw - like the rather successful 5, 18, 18 - where they're never right up front or right at the back. Always having cars to pass means, the way the points work, that you've always got a chance to improve your situation overall if necessary. If you're in the lead, that's it, you can't do anymore, while everything else unfurls behind you. Of course, if you've won your first heat from the back it's no drama, but that won't happen very often at the top level. Barry B
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Post by BarryB on Jan 19, 2024 19:03:04 GMT 12
Once you progress from being a keyboard racer to real life racer you will learn So you are admitting there's no difference and no matter what grid positions you get, over a 2 heat format it's all down to who passes the most cars whether that's front-rear, middle-middle, or in between. Use logic, not juvenile insults please. However it's done, effectively whoever passes the most cars comes out on top [without getting into DNFs, DNSs and other such erregularities] Barry B
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Post by keyboardracer on Jan 19, 2024 19:06:39 GMT 12
So you are admitting there's no difference and no matter what grid positions you get, over a 2 heat format it's all down to who passes the most cars whether that's front-rear, middle-middle, or in between. Use logic, not juvenile insults please. Read my reply the first time so i dont have to repeat it for you… Its hard to get a clean run when you and sandwiched in the middle of the pack 2 races in a row very high chance of getting a dnf… Did you see the repocharge at stratford?? You would rather be at the back or the front everytime I can cherry pick data aswell.....so you'd rather be in the grid positions 2 or 4 and ride the freight train into the infamous turn 1-2 at the start? With a high chance of ending up in the wall/rolled? The fact of the matter is looking at it logically, with 2 heats, the cars that pass the most cars over the 2 heats will end up with the highest points and qualify. That's the data, and it can't be disputed.
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Post by BarryB on Jan 19, 2024 20:50:28 GMT 12
Read my reply the first time so i dont have to repeat it for you… Its hard to get a clean run when you and sandwiched in the middle of the pack 2 races in a row very high chance of getting a dnf… Did you see the repocharge at stratford?? You would rather be at the back or the front everytime I can cherry pick data aswell.....so you'd rather be in the grid positions 2 or 4 and ride the freight train into the infamous turn 1-2 at the start? With a high chance of ending up in the wall/rolled? The fact of the matter is looking at it logically, with 2 heats, the cars that pass the most cars over the 2 heats will end up with the highest points and qualify. That's the data, and it can't be disputed. As Kevin Bacon said in the outstanding 1992 movie "A Few Good Men"; "These are the facts of the case, and they are undisputed."
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Post by salooncar on Jan 19, 2024 21:26:05 GMT 12
Not at all you are stuck in the middle of the pack 2 races in a row Hard to get a clean run when that happens high chance of damage But how's it any different to front/rear? You still have the same amount of cars to pass no matter what your grid positions are over the 2 heats You don't normally have the same number to pass. If your later heats are (closer) to the rear of the field there will be cars missing from the grid ahead of you due to prior damage. Thus you get some "free" passes in those heats. If you've got a quick car so you can stay out of trouble at the front the ideal is really front then rear for a 2 heat format, and front, middle, rear for a 3 heat. I guess if you'd ever actually been out and competed in any class you'd know that.
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Post by BarryB on Jan 20, 2024 0:09:45 GMT 12
But how's it any different to front/rear? You still have the same amount of cars to pass no matter what your grid positions are over the 2 heats You don't normally have the same number to pass. If your later heats are (closer) to the rear of the field there will be cars missing from the grid ahead of you due to prior damage. Thus you get some "free" passes in those heats. If you've got a quick car so you can stay out of trouble at the front the ideal is really front then rear for a 2 heat format, and front, middle, rear for a 3 heat. I guess if you'd ever actually been out and competed in any class you'd know that. You theory is right, in theory, but that's all it is, a theory based on potential free passes. That can depend on so many things. Contact or non-contact being an obvious one. When running the 3 heat format in the non-contact classes, balancing up the "free passes" you may or may not get, is the fact that the track goes off as the night progresses, making it harder to pass. So while a driver might be capable of passing 10 cars in a 20 car field from the back in heat 1, let's call him Dude 1, an equal car/driver combo (Dude 2) might only be able to pass 5 cars on the slicker track should he have drawn his back grid later in the night. That means if Dude 2 only got 3 "free passes" he's still 2 points off the pace of Dude 1. It can also depend on the other cars/drivers around you on the grid, whatever the class. Some drivers are much easier to pass than others, and a quick pass can set you up for another, and another. The longer any pass takes, the less you're likely to get done by race's end. In complete contrast to your theory, Asher Rees recently won his third NZ Superstock title super-impressively with a back, middle, front grid draw. Many a 3 heat championship has been won by a driver with such a grid draw. In a non contact class the track is more drive early in the night for making those outside passes from the rear. And in a contact class you can generally throw caution to the wind coming through the pack from the pack in heat 1 where everybody is racing for the championship and not stalking prey. That becomes more difficult as the night and championship progresses. As for your comment "I guess if you'd ever actually been out and competed in any class you'd know that"? Not very nice. The vast majority of competitors out there have never actually mastered the art either. And what suits one driver may be the opposite preference to another. What works one weekend may not work with the same competitors on the same track from the same grid draw 7 days later. In fact, dirt track racing being what it is, it's extremely unlikely you'd get the same result two weeks in a row. That's what I've gained from following, spectating, photographing, writing about, commentating on and doing stats on speedway for about 40 years, but despite NEVER actually having been out and competed in any class, I still know that. Barry B
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Post by keyboardracer on Jan 20, 2024 2:56:22 GMT 12
But how's it any different to front/rear? You still have the same amount of cars to pass no matter what your grid positions are over the 2 heats You don't normally have the same number to pass. If your later heats are (closer) to the rear of the field there will be cars missing from the grid ahead of you due to prior damage. Thus you get some "free" passes in those heats. If you've got a quick car so you can stay out of trouble at the front the ideal is really front then rear for a 2 heat format, and front, middle, rear for a 3 heat. I guess if you'd ever actually been out and competed in any class you'd know that. Imagine going onto a fan supporters page and acting with a level of entitlement towards non racers.... which is actually a poor argument because I have in fact been out and competed. That argument also doesn't add any value, because he is arguing that 2 middle grids are hard done by. By using your exact argument, that would actually impact someone with a rear then front grid more, so in that instance a middle-middle grid would be an advantage. Pretty much to cut a long story short, you are clutching at straws and making a big deal out of nothing. And I personally don't think any drivers there actually competing are going to think it was a waste of a trip just because of a grid draw.
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Post by grindingdisc on Jan 20, 2024 4:08:46 GMT 12
Imagine going on a speedway forum and getting upset about being a called a key board racer when your username is keyboard racer
The issue is 2 races and no repercharge, would make more sense to focus on why you are there and thats to race for the world title not make sure you get all the consulation races in
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Post by meeaneemic on Jan 20, 2024 4:33:04 GMT 12
Not at all you are stuck in the middle of the pack 2 races in a row Hard to get a clean run when that happens high chance of damage But how's it any different to front/rear? You still have the same amount of cars to pass no matter what your grid positions are over the 2 heats At the front you have a clear track and can hopefully avoid the first turn push. At the back you will have probably already gained positions with cars not making the heat 2 grid and you can also hold back on turn 1 or slip up the inside of the push. Middle grids you are the meat in the sandwich with less options. Mid Mid and Front Back are vastly different.
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Post by meeaneemic on Jan 20, 2024 4:35:41 GMT 12
Showers forecast in the morning then clearing. How much time does Stan need to get the track ready? Meeanee resurrected the track by putting a layer of gravel over the track and steamrollering it in. It saved the meeting. While I'm not an expert in track prep I've watched Stan many times at the Valley of Paradise and it is an art form. You do need time. I'd rather watch 10 superstock races on a fantastic track (no pressure Stan) rather than a rushed prepared track and 18 superstock races. It certainly is cut throat with only 2 races to qual and there will be some top drivers who miss out. The track did appear good for the 2nd half of the night at meeanee Gravel does sound rather concerning though?? I think i would rather be hit in the face by a ball of mud than i would a stone!! If this is true do you know what grade of gravel? I am really suprised speedway nz allowed this to be honest, the track will need to be relayed and all the stones screened out of it Gravel!!!. I didn't see them doing that.
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Post by Helios on Jan 20, 2024 7:37:47 GMT 12
Betcha didn't see an actual STEAMroller, either 😊
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Post by beachboy on Jan 20, 2024 8:03:36 GMT 12
Its already bloody hard to qualify now its even more cut throat Id be pissed off if i traveled the length of the country to race in this event to have the format that you signed up to chopped and changed so poorly feel sorry for the guys getting dished up 2 middle grid draws Qualifying after all is why you came there and everyone deserves a fair chance and its first big main part of the weekend for the drivers anything after you dont qualify is only bonus The final heat of finals isnt going to be run any earlier in the night no matter the format you run so how would you run it any different grindingdisc ? would you have a higher competitor and spectator entry price so you could cover the costs to have all the medics and other people who are needed to run the meeting available on call to work the whole day on Saturday if needed to fit the entire original meeting format into one day? Don't bag the club without giving a solution.
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